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vArranger and VST !!

Started by Dan, December 25, 2013, 05:38:05 PM

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Dan

Did I say that the new beta version allow you to play with VST instruments?

pax_eterna

 ;D You just did Dan!  And this is a great development, thanks.

Dennis

Dan

This is a first step, to try ...

Some plugins are requeting to run vArranger as admin...

one

how do i do this. where does  the VST go.  In with the sample folder. please give me some direction. thanks 

Dan

In the new version, in the MIDI OUT lists, you have a line VST...

claudiodecubellis

hi Dan you can try out the new beta version? thanks

Dan


paoloca59


paoloaccordion

Could you explain the settings to run the vst? In Varranger date we need to create a folder to insert the vst?

stewbow

Dan
how do i set up to play a VST Instrument
stuart

Dan

You go on OPTIONS/MIDI PORTS
On each midi out there is a line called VST
You click on it, and select your VSTi DLL.

Then on vArranger, you can see the VST1 VST2 and VST3 buttons.

You can also right click on every track to select witch VST to use.

stewbow

i did as you said, Options, Midi, but none of the 3 Midi Outs gave me a VST Option

I have installed the B4 11 Organ VST, the files have gone into the automatically selected folders, do I have to move a Dll to somewhere else?

Dan

If you don't have a VST line, you need to redownload and install the vArranger Synth plugin, from the email.

stewbow

Wow, looks good. haven't quite got the midi channels set up right yet, but he wife's just summoned me for a trip to the Cafe

try again later

thank you so much

Stuart

stewbow

just had another quick look,
When I click on VST2, the organ window opens up and if I click on the keyboard with the mouse it plays ok. but my controller keyboard wont make the organ play.

Only the left of the 3 midi pictures at the top light up when I play.

I have tried right clicking on Right 1 and selecting midi 2, and it still wont play

any ideas

Stuart

Dan

Yes.
Inside your VST, assign the upper channel to 13. This is the Right1 of vArranger

stewbow

excellent
works really well

well done

Stuart

stewbow

Dan
Just a few more queries, I didn't have too much time today to experiment,,,

Regarding The B4 11 organ VST(as that's the only one I've installed so far), can the settings be saved, and recalled? Maybe in the Right Hand  Voice section?

I also noticed that when I operated the modulation wheel on my keyboard it didn't operate the Lesley effect, are there now more options in the controller section?

Does the controller section now allow you to maybe assign a slider to the volume of the VST?

Thanks

Stuart

Dan

You are true. The next step for me it to save/recall the state of VST, and control it from vArranger.
Also adding 16 VST and not 3

If the VST is understanding the MIDI volume messages, yes you can assign it, but if it's not, there is a second way to change a VST setting (if it allows it), that I need to work on.

Every VST is different, and has different settings, and not all can play sounds on the 16 midi channels... so things are not so easy.
But of course I will add this.

This version is a very early to test VST on vArranger :)

stewbow

Great reply
That saves me hours of looking for something that isn't there yet ;)

All the best

Stuart

Dan

Thank you too.
Nice to hear that NI B4II is working with the vArranger VST host :)

pax_eterna

Just been running it with Addictive Drums - sweet! I am playing manual bass and keys along with it, no other arranger parts. I am getting a really cool "trio combo" vibe.

IMO,  VST support is about the best thing you have added Dan! Even if only three...with VST's like Sampletank (16 parts available in one VST) one really only needs one VST, but having 16 separate outs- wow just think of the possibilities!!!

Anyway just wanted to say thanks for this most important of additions.

Dennis

Dan

Thank You Dennis :)
Even VST Host where possible many years ago with a virtual cable, loading them directly from vArranger is something very cool
Virtual Instruments will be more easy to use for everyone

pax_eterna

Yes I agree Dan, using virtual midi  it was possible, but the way you have it set up makes it just so easy and especially so having it all there from the one window and app

One question...will it be possible in the future to save the VST out assignment (for example VST out 2) to a part? In my case for example I use VST out 2 (which is assigned to Addictive drums) set to the drum part. At the moment when I change a style the VST defaults back to VST 1 - not an issue as I can always change AD to VST 1 instead, but I just wondered.

Thanks

PS: How far along is the option for directly saving style edits to the style itself? Again not and issue at all, just curious :)

Dan

You can already save the MIDI OUT 1/2/3 assigns when you SAVE SONG, or SAVE RIGHT SOUND

You can also set is as the DEFAULT MIDI OUTS assign on SAVE STARTUP CONFIG

pax_eterna

Cool Dan, yeah I was aware of that method - I was more enquiring about the style itself and being able to save directly to it...but after more thought following your reply, it was probs a redundant question as I think I agree that it is better to save to a particular song as one may want different set ups for each song even if using the same "base" style...

Dennis


Dan

I have decided from the beginning to never overwrite the style itself, but add a second file to store all the vArranger modifications.


stewbow

Dan
I've been experimenting with the NI B411 VST Organ.
For those that don't know, the B4 is an incredible Hammond Replica Organ with lots of presents such as Whiter Shade of Pale. The Lesley Effect and the Distortion is bang on.

I got the Lesley effect working, you have to set the Upper Manual and the controller channel both to 13 (Right 1 on Varranger)

Once you have selected the midi channel and a Preset, just using Right 1 (set to midi 2, the B4 VST) is plays perfectly.

I can then save as a Song, and when I load the Song back in it selects the Right 1 (set to midi 2) picks out the B4 organ, but not the right patch!!!!!!

good fun

stuart





Dan

I see that on NIB4, you can select the preset with a midi program change, so, select it on vArranger (right click on a track, SOUND EDIT)  here you can enter a program change manually.

Before saving song, you need to SAVE RIGHT SOUND, and name it as you want

Dan

A new Beta4 version is available to test, with 16 VST instruments for vArranger
I had to change so much things, do a full save of your vArrangerData folder before testing !

cirerenrut

Dan
Willing to test the Beta if it helps.

Eric

pax_eterna

Yes please add me to that list for the new beta Dan, always happy to trial new betas- not that I get a lot of time these days. It seems to be always running out, as it certainly must do for you too  ;)

paoloaccordion

Hello Dan can send me the new version? You already have the vst?

stewbow

Dan
I'd like to try it please

Stuart

pax_eterna

Quote from: paoloaccordion on February 11, 2014, 05:09:11 PM
Hello Dan can send me the new version? You already have the vst?

I would suggest the VST's need to come from you ;)

Torben

I also want to try the latest beta. I am experimenting with this http://www.linplug.com/organ_3.html
Torben

BjayG

Hi Chaps,

I noticed the comments about VSTs and the use of various Hammond Organ VSTs.

The Native Instruments B4 is great, but unless NI have changed their minds then its no longer available - and for some years which is a real pity.   I tried the linplug one - but it really didn't do anything for me.  It I remember correctly (it was several years ago) then it seemed to be geared towards modern dance music.   

One alternative I found which is very good indeed (as good as the B4 in my opinion) is the GSI VB3.  It quite cheap to buy and the developer is, like Dan an enthusiastic individual - so should be supported in my opinion.   

Here is a link to the product with demos of the sound and I also see a downloadable demo of the product - so maybe you can try it with vArranger:-

http://www.genuinesoundware.com/?a=showproduct&b=24

And here is a rather long and over-bloated review on YoutTube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44BP6Gnp0Hs

I hope this is of some help to somebody.

Cheers
Barry


 


stewbow

The B4 can be easily found if you do a little search ;)

I watched the video of the VB3, the guy is like Rick Wakeman on Steroids!!!!! the stereo lesley effect was driving me mad through my headphones, that effect is mono only in my book

Stuart

stewbow

Dan

I loaded in the latest Beta, right clicked on Right Voice 1 and comes up with a box saying Unhandled exception in your application etc etc

Craaaaaaassssshhhhhhhhhhh :-\

stuart

Dan

Can you download and install everything again?
I have found a problem with NI B4II because it crash when I send the MASTER VOLUME SYSEX
Still need to correct this

paoloaccordion

Quote from: pax_eterna on February 11, 2014, 07:47:08 PM
Quote from: paoloaccordion on February 11, 2014, 05:09:11 PM
Hello Dan can send me the new version? You already have the vst?

I would suggest the VST's need to come from you ;)

I do not feel the vst. What does it depend? You might know the configuration to make them play?

stewbow

Dan
I downloaded again as you suggested
OK, the latest download seems ok, but it's asking me for the latest software syth when it loads up.
The midi window doesn't show the soft synth and it doesn't give me a VST option now.

I found the varranger synth in programme Data/Plugins,,,,,, do I need to move it somewhere else

thanks

Stuart

Dan

You need to redownload and execute the synth install

claudiodecubellis

Hello Dan can send me the new version?
thanks Claudio

stewbow

Dan
have you managed to get the B4 working on the Surface Pro?

Dan

I am still working with this B4...
I have added a sysex message for master volume who crash the B4.
So I need to correct this, or simply remove this message for B4..

But then, it will work... why?

stewbow

i was thinking of getting a Surface Pro, but I really want the B4 to work on it.

I have it going really well on a Windows 7 PC with a Varranger Version from about 6 weeks ago, but not sure whether it would work on windows 8

Stuart

BjayG


Quote:    The B4 can be easily found if you do a little search ;)

If anyone downloads unauthorized (e.g. cracked) software from suspect sites then I hope they have industrial strength anti-malware software installed on their computer - as these things are not usually cracked for the fun of it.      Personally - as an ex professional software developer - I actually hope it does trash their computer - well deserved!!

Anyway ...

Dan ...

I installed VB3 and it only just works - but there are some issues which I assume may be related to the beta state of your VST development.  I certainly feel the problems can be overcome.

Here is what I found ...

1) Initially it would not run at all - but I then noticed that it was trying to install VB3.INI in the program_files directory (on both Win7 and Win8).  Clearly Win7 and 8 get a bit unhappy if you start trying to write these things in these system directories.  So moving VB3.DLL to a non-system directory made it run.     I wasn't quite sure whether it was vArranger writing the VB3.INI file or VB3 itself - but you will know.

2) Second problem is that whenever I tried to select the Focusrite USB ASIO audio driver I get the message 'Error 14 - ASIO initialisation failed' .    It seemed to work with the  ASIO4ALL - at least it connected - but something at this point did something strange to my computer in that some (?all) of my VST synths seemed to get linked to ASIO4ALL rather than the Focusrite ASIO drivers normally used.  In the end I removed the ASIO4ALL driver and rebooted and all seems well.  However, I don't intend to put ASIO4ALL back as I don't need it anyway.     I suspect the problem was not caused by ASIO4ALL - but was caused my computer simply getting in a muddle because of all the different changes.

3)  There was an issue - caused directly by me because I ran it twice I think - in that I seemed to have two versions of vArranger Synth  (at least there were 2 icons in the notification area mentioning it).   So for my education - can you please tell me what running the vArrangersynth.exe actually does to the computer.   It will then give me a clue what to look out for in the future as nothing appears to get installed in the normal sense - so something must be happening somewhere and it would be helpful to know what.

Its looking good though.

Cheers
Barry


Dan

Well, I have just released a new Beta4 version who avoid to send SysEx messages to NI B4II so it will work now.
You can redownload and install the 2 files again...

Barry,

1) Yes, VB3 can't write in the VB3.ini because Windows does not allows te write in the Program Files folder.
If you runvArranger as Administrator, it will be able to do it

2) Maybe the new version correct this. Most of audio card asio drivers can't run 2 program together using ASIO.

3) Simply install the latest synth sent once.
In the Task manager, you can see the vArranger2.exe program and the vASynth.exe program who includes all the new audio features (ASIO/WASAPI/DirectSound/SoundFonts/Synthesizer/VST/MP3...)

pax_eterna

Quote from: Dan on February 13, 2014, 12:16:21 PM
............ Most of audio card asio drivers can't run 2 program together using ASIO.

Not the fault of the Audio Interface makers or ASIO, it is an inherent issue in the Windows OS, always has been...

The way around it, if one wants to use two interfaces with low latency (and avoid using the ghastly ASIO4All, as useful as it is) you run one on ASIO and the other on wasAPI which is the Microsoft "version" of ASIO.

stewbow

I got Musiclab Real Guitar Les Paul working as a VST, but it's a Dry Sound.
Is there anyway of inserting something like Guitar Rig?

stuart

Dan

Is there any FX included on the VSTi?

For now you can't add an VST FX on a VSTi

stewbow

no FX on the VST

ok, just checking

stuart

stewbow

Dan

I played around with Arturia Mini Moog but recalling the saved voices was a problem, sometimes they worked other times they didn't, Ive now uninstalled it.
Todays mission was to install Dimension Pro 1.5. This is really good, no noticable latency, the sounds and effects are tremendous, BUT !!!!
There is a slight problem, and I believe it is within VArranger.
The Dimension Pro Voices keep losing The Attack, it's as if the instruments are being Bowed like a slow violin.
If I remove the DP VST and then load it in again, the problem goes, but I just saved a DP voice and put on the my sounds bar, selected a SD2 voice and then went back to the DP voice and the Lack of Attack is there again.
No matter what voice I select from within DP it's still the same, No Attack!!!

any thoughts?

Stuart


stewbow

#54
Dan
Still experimenting, It does exactly the same thing with Kontakt 4 Samples

Stuart

Actually, the problem with the MiniMoog VST was probably the same think

Dan

mmm... I have tried the Dimension pro too.
vArranger sends a midi message of 64 as the default value for attack.
The default value for GM2 synths for attack is 64.
It seems that some VST are reacting to this message, but they seem to prefer the value 0 !

Try to right click on the track, SOUND EDIT, and change the Attack slider from 64 to 0...

Still not sure what to do with that.

pax_eterna

Might be something, might be nothing :D but as you know Ketron (and other OS designers) us 0 as the centrein midi programming...ie  -64  0  +63  instead of 0-127

Dennis

Dan

Yes, but I think it is in the GM2 standards.
All hardware synths use this. But some VST designers does not know very good MIDI :)

pax_eterna

Quote from: Dan on February 22, 2014, 11:30:39 PM
...............But some VST designers does not know very good MIDI :)

Ain't that the truth!!!  Been fighting it for years. I THINK the VST3 specs allow for nearly full midi implementation..

Dan

If they don't know with VST2, they will not with VST3 :)

VST format let a lot of freedom. Everyone do what he wants...

pax_eterna

#60
Yeah, I agree, but Steinberg have changed a fair bit in the VST3 specs Dan....

Just a small snippet from http://www.steinberg.net/en/company/technologies/vst3.html

No MIDI restriction for parameter value transfers
VST3 has a dedicated interface for event handling that carries a much wider range of functionality than standard MIDI events would be able to provide. This opens up a big range of opportunities for musical use cases with very high potential for innovative product design. For example with VST3 some controller events (for example, pitch) can be referred to a note event (using a note unique ID). This offers the possibility to e.g. modulate only a single note which itself is part of a chord.


Multiple MIDI inputs/outputs
Unlike with VST 2.x,, a VST3 plug-in can have more than only one MIDI input or one MIDI output at the same time.


I have no VST3 instruments yet so I have not been able to investigate it further...but hopefully "under the bonnet" there is more to come...

stewbow

Dan
I did as you say, change the values in attack to 0 ( I also zero'd some of the other parameters as well ) and it saved and recalled ok.
Next Problem:-
I have loaded in 4 Dimension Pro VST's, with 4 patches, saved each of them and put them on the My Sounds Bar, and they play perfectly.

But when I save as a song and also the startup config, when I open up the programme again, the names of the saved patches are on the My Sounds Bar, but the 4 Dimension Pro VST's haven't loaded in their 4 patches.
Dimension Pro, and I'm assuming other sample based players don't respond to Programme Change messages.

I Know that when loading in a project in Sonar all the DP voices are recalled, could you add it to VArranger?

This article touches on the issue,

Dan

Yes, basically with VST, from what I have understood, you can select a sound by :
- Sending Program Change MIDI message
- Some VST have a preset list. The host can select a VST Program.  I am adding this feature now.
- The host can change some VST parameters that the plugin expose.  If one of them is a Sound number, it can change this. The previous preset (or program), is a set of all parameters.
- Some VST can SAVE their full state, and then the host can restore this state in the future. But this can take some time to load again, if there is many samples to load for all channels. I need to add this too... Maybe per song/sound/global...? This is how sonar does.  But this will break the concept of putting sounds in the 16 tracks of vArranger

So 4 ways to do it... Every plugin decide witch way to go. I need to add more options...

stewbow

Dan
16 channels each using VST, sounds great, but would it ever be used?
I'm sure there are lots of different uses for VArranger, from the basic load and play upto spending hours exploring VST's ;)

My personal aim is to take it out gigging as follows:-
1- I need it to play Midi and MP3 File backing tracks and be able to play different sounds at the touch of a button.
       We can do this at the moment, but I would like to be able to select the next song during the present one playing without the next one starting in the middle of the present one.
       Also, it would be really useful to have a larger popup type window displaying my list of user files (songs, mp3 and midi files) The top 40% of the screen I never look at, perhaps a window could popup in that area?
2- I want to go back to playing as much live as possible (I used to take a Roland Pro E and a DX7 out 30 years ago and that was all played live) and the VArranger is amazing for this. I am using the Ketron SD2 for sounds and it's really good.
       There are several sounds that I need to be able to play with the Right Hand that the SD2, I don't feel, is good enough for.
       Hammond Organ with Lesley is one of them, the B4 VST takes care of this and it does receive Programme Changes.
       The Holy Grail is the Realistic Electric Guitar. Kontakt and Dimension Pro have patches that I would like to use for this, but the recall voice issue needs to be sorted out.
       Arturia Minimoog  also receives Prog Changes and allows me to recall early Yes and Genesis memories.

Other than that, I personally can't imagine what other VST's I would require

Hope you don't mind these comments and suggestions

Stuart

pax_eterna

What I found easy to do, was to use vA with a VST host. In my case I used Cantabile as it allows one to select "scenes" and song setups via midi. I would set up Cantabile "sets" with 5 vst's (Bass Drums, Guitar, Acoustic Keys and Electric keys - the latter two for my live playing. Each of these was set to the matching channel from vA and to accept note and controller data only, no patch changes.

AS I said above, I blocked program changes coming in from vA and instead used presets created in Cantabile for different styles. As it was using bass gtr and drums only, there were not too many variations..much like when one is playing with a live band...the bass player does not have multiple basses on stage, and the drummer uses one kit for the gig etc...all that changes are the effects used, hence the need for setup variations, not wholesale changes of instruments.
Worked quite well too....

As an aside, I have ALWAYS used arrangers (hardware and software) and backing tracks in a manner as close to a live ensemble or band as I could make it. The bare minimum of instrumentation, and with only subtle changes to effects that would be used in a live setting, I pretty much use the same drum kit for most songs on any one gig, for example....

Lylo

#65
Hello,

me to, I use vArranger with Cantabile since two years ago.
But now is more simple and comfortable with the vsti in the software.
I'm really excited by this new feature (and the vAsynth), only in Beta test now but soon in standard version.

I make a backing track for a singer with this new feature : "You do something to me" http://www.4shared.com/mp3/ber3n7BWba/Ydstm.html
(the original song http://youtu.be/tM1rSTOs7Zs )

It's just for work in progress at home but I think is interesting because that's made in two hours (song chord and Yamaha style).

And the sounds vsti are not necessarely expensive :

Drums canal 10 VSTI : Uviworkstation - DrumTasteFree (AcousticSamples) - freeware
Drums canal 9 vAsynth : Live drum "Pop" - Virtual Sd2 made by magali
Bass VSTI :  Uviworkstation - West Indies Bass long-light - freeware
Guitar steel vAsynth :  Guitar "pop" - soundfont from web revised by Lylo and magali
Guitar disto VSTI : Luxonix Purity - (commercial product)
Nappes vAsynth : soundfont from web revised by Lylo
Piano VSTI : Uviworkstation - Grand piano collection "Japanese Grand Piano - (commercial product)

I have taking the Japanese Grand Piano but for the same result, I can take the "Splendid Piano" (free soundfont 250mo), same thing for the disto guitar.

fazfaz


Lylo

Thank fazfaz, but me I say : Bravo Dan !!!!  ;)

BjayG

Hi,

I think the last few messages are quite interesting and informative.

I too have been playing with the VST option and have been wondering what we were actually trying to achieve here and I think these messages have crystalised my views.

Its seems to me that vArranger is a fantastic arranger - probably as good, or even better than many hardware arranger keyboards, and I don't think that point should be lost by making it into an all singing all dancing VST host like Cantabile or Brainspawn.   If nothing else the permutations and combinations that could arise could make it extremely complex, unwieldy and possibly flakey. Indeed I actually wonder how many people in the real world of arrangers will actually use these facilities  (I suspect very few!).

I also worry that Dan may possibly be going through hoops to add the VST support because some people cannot afford, or don't want to afford, an SD2/1000 and thereby make it more attractive to potential purchasers.    I do think alternatives are relevant in case the SD 2/1000 become obsolete - but the reality is that even after buying the vArranger program, an SD2 and a midi keyboard - the cost is still much much less than the equivalent hardware arranger keyboard.   Even old computers will work with this combination - but I have severe doubts about computer power once people start to use VSTs.

I think there is still a good argument for basic VST support - but not to a complex level.   Indeed as long as people can use programs such as Cantabile as a host (I think there is a free version) then maybe that should be the recommended route for more exotic users - i.e. vArranger should ensure that the correct midi data is transferred to allow e.g. Cantabile to work correctly.


My list for VST support, therefore, is very simple and would include the following:

1) An alternative and equivalent sound source to the SD2 /1000.  I actually think the SD2/1000 are really good. They sound great; have zero latency; just get on with the job without complex setup and don't need a beefy computer to run them.  A good example of an equivalent VST would be HalionSonic 2 - which I understand has a lot of sounds created by Yamaha (as Steinberg are now owned by Yamaha) and is not outrageously expensive for what it does. There will be others.

2) A special/specific VST sound source for one or more parts with the SD2/1000 doing most of the work.   An example may be a better piano, organ, bass or a synth sound.   

3) It would NOT include separate VST effects (other than those built into VSTi s)

I personally still think there is work to be done in making vArranger better (e.g. I would really like to see it have total presets or snapshots of all the settings).  If Dan really wants to make the program attractive to more people - if thats part of the motivation - then he needs to sort out the English manual as the translated one is barely adequate - and also make it a bit more comprehensive.  The support that Dan supplies is great - but I get frustrated that some things are only possible once you get an email from Dan or see an answer on the forum on how to do it.   Also the lack of a demo is losing a lot of business.  A demo is clearly difficult as you need an SD2 to really try it - but perhaps a good demo in the form of a comprehensive video in English (sorry 'mes amis' - but thats where the major market is) lasting say 10 minutes would be a lot better than nothing.   I know that an acquaintance of mine was interested in vArranger - but could not make out from the web site what it actually did - so gave up.  349 Euros is a lot of money to take on trust.

Sorry - I'm honestly not trying to be controversial or negative - this is just my opinion - and Dan will/must do whatever he think is right. 

But I repeat - this program is seriously FANTASTIC and well worth the money...

Cheers
Barry

pax_eterna

Well you can always get a refund ;) perhaps your friend did not research it enough!

To be blunt, I think this is post is from someone with little knowledge of either vA or VST instruments and effects. I suggest you go away get a bit more experience and then start pontificating on how things should be ;)

I mean Halionsonic2 ?? REALLY!? sheesh give me strength

JM 2 cents

Lylo

BjayG,

I'm sorry but in the french forum, the customers works for vArranger.
The manual is in french langage yes, the editor is a french customer, find a english customer for make the translate.
I prefer Dan for development of vsti includes in vArranger rather the manual.

I work from a long time with Cantabile Lite, I never use the SD2 since two years but some sounds are from SD2, if you are curious you can find the samples of Sd2 in the webspace.
Currently a french customer made a sound bank with SD2 for the vAsynth, normaly the sounds will be free for all customers.
Me to, I work for vasynth, I try to create a soundfonts banks same as the SD2 (for the place of sound in place of program change) with free soundfonts.
Freely for varranger customers when it's ok to work of course.

The vsti host included in vArranger will be more efficient rather than the combination Cantabile/vArranger.
No sound card multi-client necessary for work in ASIO mode, just one output (and one input in the sono).
Vsti in vArranger are more manipulatables, it's more easy for work with vsti and many people will find this new feature good for this reason.

I understand your anxiety for vArranger, the software became complex, but it's naturally, if you want to be good for a long time you must have evoluate, the SD2 is hardware and by the way promise for obsolescence.

And a question.
You don't have confidence in Dan ?
You say, vArranger is really good now, vArranger is born in 2008 and progressed since this time, why the vsti will create a problem now, at this time ? Because you say that ?
Me I have confidence in Dan because I think is very talentuous developer and talent is without limit.

My million cents.  ;)

(sorry for my poor english)

KOOY

Hello Barry,

The program is worth every penny. You will enjoy it 100%. There are some things in  it that are not ok but Dan is working on that and new functionality.

You can buy it.

Dan

Hello Barry,

If I understand well, here is the summary of what you said :
- vArranger is a fantastic arranger   Thank You :)

Then you advice me to not work on the VST Host because of :

-We can use cantabile free software. I think the vArranger VST Host is more simple to use and completely integrated in vArranger
-Lose time. Yes I loosed many time on adding the VST Host. I hope this worth the effort
-Program become complex. Finally, not that much. More complex inside maybe, but for the user, I try to do it very simple. Only one line in the MIDI PORT to say I want to use VST, and ONLY in this case, this add only ONE VST button in the interface, who display the VST rack and the name of VST when you right clik on tracks.
- VST add bugs. Yes, you are right. If the VST plugin is crashing, it often cause the Host (vArranger) to crash too. So vArranger stability become dependent of the VST instrument you load. This is the risk right... I have to accept this for now...
- VST is for only few customers. All vArranger users who use VST instruments will come to say you are wrong and will be angry because they want me to continue this way :)
- You think everyone need a SD2/SD1000, and VST can't replace it. Yes and No... You can also use SD2 + VST
- VST need a more powerful computer You are Right

Why I have added VST support for vArranger :
- Because I like simple things, like most of people. Now VST in vArranger is very simple, compared to what it was in the past.
- No need of installing a virtual midi cable.  No need to install a VST Host software. No need to configure other software...
- All in one solution. VST instruments are ready to play when you run vArranger. No need to run separate software, and reload things...
- You can use VST instrumens AND the vArranger SoundFonts synth mixed together in one audio out.
- You can play a MP3 in vArranger and also play VST mixed together in one audio out. Most of audio cards don't accept 2 software to use the same audio out.
- Sending any vArranger track to any VST instruments with a simple and flexible way.
- Saving and restoring of VST parameters... When you change sound or song...

As you said finally, VST support in vArranger is good for people who need to play a good sound like B3 Organ, piano.. for melody...

Audio features (VST, SoundFonts, vArranger GM Synth, ASIO, WASAPI, etc...) are very new inside vArranger, and still in beta stage. The manual does not talk about them already, but will. We are discovering possibilities together. And for now it's very good !
You are always free to NOT use all those new features. Just don't select the VST or vA Synth line but your SD2.

About other need :
You Want total snapshots of all the settings in vArranger.  This is the goal of SAVE SONG feature.
You have noticed me that you need the SPLIT point and LINK button to be saved too. I will add it.




Better translated English manual YES you are right

A good demo in the form of a comprehensive video in English YES you are right

I don't speak English enough good to create good video or manual. If someone here want to help, let me know.

Lylo

QuoteYou are always free to NOT use all those new features. Just don't select the VST or vA Synth line but your SD2.


And you can always ask Dan for new features for vArranger and the SD2 at your convenience.  ;)

cirerenrut

You can satisfy some of the people all of the time, and all the people some of the time, but never all people all of the time.
Dan can I have chord harmony when I play the melody ?.

Eric

Dan


cirerenrut

Thanks Dan.
Eric ( satisfied customer )

Brian

Hi Dan,
I would like to try Beta version of vArranger.
Many thanks,
Brian.

stewbow

Dan
Could we have more Bells and Whistles Please





English Joke ;)

Dan

Youpeee

Was able to save full state of VST plugins and the restore it.

stewbow


Dan

#81
The new beta4 is ready to download :)

In the VST rack, I have put a "+", then you can SAVE the current VST full state to disk.
It will be loaded again at vArranger's startup.

This is usefull with plugins like Kontakt, independance, etc with lot of samples to load, or things to set before getting ready.

Not all plugins allows the saving of full state.

Don't save the plugin if you don't need it.  You will add some loading time to vArranger.

If you can't load vArranger after saving a VST, you can delete the files in \vArrangerData\Sounds\VSTPRESETS\

Maybe in future versions, I will allow more saving and also to save full state per song / per sound preset...

I have also added the ARABIC SCALE for the vArranger synth so you can now play arabic music with your own samples :)

Arabic scales are also available for Ketron SD2/SD4 and SD1000. more to come on demand

Added to the right click on a preset , RENAME SOUND

Enjoy...

4partmusic

Hey Dan,

Can I get then Beta 4 release please?

Thanks,

Terry

Lionel

Hi Dan,

Always watching with interest.

Can you send me link for beta 4 thanks

May not be active in forums at present but always watching and reading.

Lionel

Brian

Hi Dan,
just received the link.
Looking forward to trying it out later,
Many thanks,
Brian.

cirerenrut

Hi Dan
Can I have the new Beta 4 release please.

Eric

stewbow

well done Dan
it works really well, especially with Kontakt
The VintageOrgans in Kontakt is far better than the B4 plug

cheers

4partmusic

So I finally got to play with the new VST feature a little bit last night.  Here is what I think I understand so far:

1. Varranger VST shows up as a seperate midi out that you can select once you load it.  I was able to do that and sounds were pretty good.
2. You need to make sure that you set Varranger VST to GM soundset or you get strange noises.
3. When you select VST as a midi out you will see the VST button up by where the SF\INS button is. 
4. Selecting the VST button opens up a rack with 16 slots and you can load in any VST instrument you might have in your VST plug-in folder.

This is where I am getting a little lost. 

1. It appears that to get multi-timbral out of say SampleTank 2 you need to load 16 instances of the VST, is that correct?
2. Do I need to go through each track and assign the midi out to the VST?
3. If I assign each individual track (Drum, Perc, Bass, Accompnient 1 etc.) Can I just load one instance of SampleTank?

Sorry, my learning curve is sometimes a little slow.

Thanks,

Terry

stewbow

ok, here's my opinion so far.
I've tried allocating a seperate VST to each track and it got quite jumpy and glitchy, though having said that, the samples were quite big, but I was trying to push hard to see how far it would go.
using a SD2 for the Drums bass and accomps with VSTs for Right Hand voices works great.
In a live performance you don't need pops and glitches so a mix of hardware and software voices is I think the way to go.
The new Save feature is a big plus.

Stuart

pax_eterna

Quote from: 4partmusic on March 07, 2014, 05:12:20 PM
S
This is where I am getting a little lost. 

1. It appears that to get multi-timbral out of say SampleTank 2 you need to load 16 instances of the VST, is that correct?
2. Do I need to go through each track and assign the midi out to the VST?
3. If I assign each individual track (Drum, Perc, Bass, Accompnient 1 etc.) Can I just load one instance of SampleTank?

Sorry, my learning curve is sometimes a little slow.

Thanks,

Terry

1. No - ST is a multitimbral VST already and inside ST ensure a midi channel is set for each part (it is the default so it should already be so) - make sure you have the patches in ST on the matching channels from vA
2. No as it is driven by the channel assignment, and ergo is already selected for each part by choosing VST as the MIDI out under options.
3. Already answered at 1. ;)

pax_eterna

Quote from: stewbow on March 07, 2014, 07:35:30 PM
ok, here's my opinion so far.
I've tried allocating a seperate VST to each track and it got quite jumpy and glitchy, though having said that, the samples were quite big, but I was trying to push hard to see how far it would go.
using a SD2 for the Drums bass and accomps with VSTs for Right Hand voices works great.
In a live performance you don't need pops and glitches so a mix of hardware and software voices is I think the way to go.
The new Save feature is a big plus.

Stuart
If you run a mutlitimbral VSTi you should not have any issues. If your processor is slow and your have a small amount of RAM, you will get issues...what are your PC specs?

Dan

#91
1- Some VST are 16 part multitimbral, like any GM synth, and some are not only one sound at a time.
SampleTank can play 16 sounds together, in the 16 midi channels. So, load it only on one slot, not in the 16 slots.

2- Yes, you right clik on every track, and you set witch midi out you want to use for that track, and witch VST.
By default, the first midi out and the first VST is selected.

3. Yes

ps : if your VST is not 16 part multitimbral, you can click on the "+" in the VST rack, and check the box to send on the midi channel 1

stewbow

I'm experimenting with 4 different computers at the moment, the desktops handle VSTs better than thr laptops.

I have a fairly new HP laptop,10 inch touch screen with 2gig ram and it's sooooooo slooooow :(

What are the "rules" regarding VSTs and Ram?

Dan

First, look at the CPU. Faster it is, and better it is.
Then the RAM... it depends on how much RAM your programs need.
If you have 2 GB, Windows use 1GB for it's own , and your VST loads 1 GB of samples in memory, you will have almost no memory free, so Windows will start to become smart and take time to manage the memory. Unload some part of programs who seems to be sleeping to the hard drive, etc...
This work take energy and the synth, who need a very fast computer will be affected.
Whatever what the PC is doing it should provide always, all the synth generation and fx, etc ... within 5 milliseconds.  If not, you get a bad noise

Lylo

Hello, my laptop.

- Core 2 duo 2,2ghz
- ram 4go
- ssd system 30go
- hard disk 7200tr/m 100go
- Windows XP

Kontakt, Pianoteq, Lounge Lizard, Sampletank + 256mo soundfonts in vAsynth

It's ok and work fine.


pilkam

Hello Dan,

Could I get Beta 4 release please?

Thanks, regards

angelo

stewbow

Dan
I am adapting my midi files for VA.
I am doing a little project with a Bass Player so I have muted the midi file bass parts.
I am using Kontakt 4 Abbey Road Drums for a realistic live drummer sound on channel 10, and the odd instrument here and there on a few of the other channels.

My intention is to play from a choice of about 6 presets from Kontakt 4.

Problem!!!
When I play a style I can select any of the 6 presets no problem.
When I play a midi file, I only have Channel 16 for my Right Hand, and as soon as I select a Preset from the My sounds Bar, the volume slider on slider 16 goes to Zero, and when I push it back up there is no sound from the VST.

any ideas

Stuart

The midi channels on the presets are set to 16, as are the Kontakt voices,  the correct VSTs are selected on SEND TO MIDI OUT 2, if I select SEND TO MIDI OUT 1 the ketron voices play ok.

Dan

I just uploaded a new version.
You can use the same download link Beta4 for the synth + vArranger.

What's new?
In the VST rack, there is a + to get more options.
There you will see a list of ALL the parameters that is included and can be controlled in the VST.
For now, it is only for curious people, but the final use of this will be to be able to assign some midi controllers to change VST parameters in realtime.
For example, to move B4 drawbars with physical midi controller, etc...
You can also decide if a VST window will always stay on top
+ Some corrections and improvments

Enjoy

pax_eterna

Is this new update beta available from the download link you sent via PM a while back Dan?

Dennis

stewbow

#99
Dan
This latest version won't load up

Stuart

No, it's ok, I downloaded and ran the VarangerSynth again and it has loaded

stuart

stewbow

Dan
This is all to do with "When playing a Midi File".

I want to have a choice of 6 Right Hand VST Voices.
The Right Hand Voice sends out on Channel 16, so I can set up 6 Slots 01 to 06 using Kontakt with a different voice in each of the 6, all set to channel 16.
All these 6 voices I can put on the my sounds bar.

BUT
What I have found out is that I have to go OUT of Midi Play Mode and select the voice that I want using Right Hand 1 (channel 13), then change the midi input channel to 16 in Kontakt and then Save it as another User Voice.
So You are saving the channel 16 voice on the channel 13 Strip!!!!!!

When you go back into Midi play mode, the Right Voice can select one of of the "Channel 16" My Sounds Voices.

A bit confusing, but I can work with this

Stuart

agaton

It is dead link, I can't download a new version on link from
Beta what you send to me  :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

Dan

Dennis, it is the same link.
Agaton, I just sent you the update.
stewbow, playing sounds in midifile mode is a trick I have made :)
The SAVE RIGHT SOUND need to be used in Style mode.
If you only use Kontakt for one Right hand channel, you can select the "Send to Channel 1" in the VST options (the "+" n the rack).
Then set Kontakt to receive on channel 1.

agaton


agaton

Now, with new version, I can't open
Hypersonic 2 VST instrument in vArranger.
Before was all OK with Hypersonic 2 !!!!

stewbow

Dan
YES
keeping it channel 1 works great

really well done

Stuart

just in time for my new surface pro this afternoon

stewbow

dan
am I right in thinking that only 32 bit VSTs work in VA
stuart

Dan

I need to fix vArranger for Hypersonic soon. It has so much parameters...
Yes you can only load 32 bits VST.
There is a program called jBridge who can help, but never tried it.
Do it only if you don't have the 32 bit version of the VST.

pax_eterna

J-Bridge for the most part works well.. there seems to be issues with SampleTank in Windows 8 64bit, but apart from that J-Bridge is smooth and plays nicely in the background. YMMV

stewbow

Dan
I have a foot pedal plugged into the expression socket on my SLMk11 keyboard.
It controls the volumes of the Sd2 but not the VST instruments.
I have set Kontakt up to receive CC11 at 127 as per a YouTube video that I found, but it doesn't respond.

The red line is going up and down on the tracks

Any ideas
Stuart

Dan

I have tried Kontakt, and it seems that instruments are not reacting to Expression pedal if the sound creator did not add it.

Here is what I have found to change this :

- Open Kontakt screen
- Click on the tool icon (top left)
- Click on Mod in the Amplifier section
- Click on add modulator...
- Click on External sources->midi CC
- Replace the 1 by 11

It is done.

Let me know if it's working or not.

Dan

A new version is released who corrects the HyperSonic problem.

necdetdoni

Quote from: Lylo on February 24, 2014, 10:31:41 AM
Hello,

me to, I use vArranger with Cantabile since two years ago.
But now is more simple and comfortable with the vsti in the software.
I'm really excited by this new feature (and the vAsynth), only in Beta test now but soon in standard version.

I make a backing track for a singer with this new feature : "You do something to me" http://www.4shared.com/mp3/ber3n7BWba/Ydstm.html
(the original song http://youtu.be/tM1rSTOs7Zs )

It's just for work in progress at home but I think is interesting because that's made in two hours (song chord and Yamaha style).

And the sounds vsti are not necessarely expensive :

Drums canal 10 VSTI : Uviworkstation - DrumTasteFree (AcousticSamples) - freeware
Drums canal 9 vAsynth : Live drum "Pop" - Virtual Sd2 made by magali
Bass VSTI :  Uviworkstation - West Indies Bass long-light - freeware
Guitar steel vAsynth :  Guitar "pop" - soundfont from web revised by Lylo and magali
Guitar disto VSTI : Luxonix Purity - (commercial product)
Nappes vAsynth : soundfont from web revised by Lylo
Piano VSTI : Uviworkstation - Grand piano collection "Japanese Grand Piano - (commercial product)

I have taking the Japanese Grand Piano but for the same result, I can take the "Splendid Piano" (free soundfont 250mo), same thing for the disto guitar.

Hi where can i find virtual sd2 made by magali..thanks..

Dan


agaton

You have to buy vArranger² !!!

bluebeat

Agaton, why are you replying to a 9 (NINE!) year old thread?

olivier71500

No Agaton is a ghostbuster so you can't see the post of the person he answered  ;D


There are usually people who ask for help concerning a cracked version of Varranger. These post are most of the time deleted (by admin?)  but the answer can remain on the forum ... I suppose it's what happened to Agaton.

Olivier

bluebeat

It confused me, as 9 year old thread was bumped.

agaton

I am so blind and very, very slow. I hate this questions: I have ver. 1.16 (crack) can you send me a "new version" bla... bla... bla... and at the same time I don't look how old is the post. Mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

Woge1000

Ich hätte auch gerne VST3
Schön das Dan daran arbeitet.Würde mich freuen wenn das klappt
Gruß Wolfgang

agaton

You can use Blue Cat's PatchWork VST in VST Host for all VST3 Plugins and it funct perfect.

You cannot view this attachment.

Woge1000

Blue Cat's PatchWork VST
Es gibt da mehrere Versionen.Welche hast du für vArranger
Gruß Wolfgang

agaton


Woge1000