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The best VST synth

Started by nakeyer, November 04, 2020, 02:46:43 PM

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nakeyer

Hello!
I am new to this forum.
Can you please give me advice what MULTI-TIMBRAL VST (or maybe another software synths) is better to use with vArranger and Yamaha styles?
Thank you!

Dan

Hello,

In a 100% software solution, the best is the vArranger Software Synthesizer with our SoundBank , completed by few SF2 SFZ VST instruments

magali

That's a pretty fundamental question you're asking here.

First, we need to consider something very important. All styles in all
Manufacturers use multitimbral sound generators and a GM2 matrix.
It is this matrix that complicates things.
capable of sending 128 banks consisting of 128 banks each with 128 sounds;
That's over 2 million sounds.
Of course no arranger has all these sounds but certainly several hundred
even a few thousand.
This allows builders to create styles with very specific sounds that sometimes
have nothing to do with the midi GM1 compatibility.
The Ketron styles are satisfied with two banks containing 128 sub banks of 128 sounds each.
Or 32768 is possible.

It should be noted that only two VSTi to my knowledge are capable of meeting the GM2 matrix.

Independence of Magix (with some smiles, implementation ) and  Giga Sampler.

Emulator X , has only a few banks about 40,000 sounds, I don't remember
exactly

Virtual Sampler is capable of a bank, of 128 under banks or 16384 sounds

There are also a few VSTs that have several banks, such as Hypersonic from
Steinberg.

With patience you can redirect sounds by reprogramming styles.

All other softs will therefore have serious limits but nothing prevents you from using up to 16 VSTi.

Having said that, there is nothing better at the moment than the Yamaha bank with the reader
built-in softsynth for Yamaha styles and an SD2 or SD 1000 for Ketron styles.

Please note that Yamaha compatible bank , will soon be integrating the new version of the Genos.

nakeyer

Thank you for pretty fundamental answer!  ;)
More interesting for me is to know what VST (or sound bank..) produce more better sound using EXACTLY Yamaha styles in vArranger! I am not interested how many voices it (VST or something else) will produce.
"... the vArranger Software Synthesizer with our SoundBank , completed by few SF2 SFZ VST instruments..." - it sounds great! Where I can take a look on examples?

Dan

https://www.varranger.com/audio/genos.mp3

It is now even better ... and will be even better soon ...

Ronny

I'll follow this item with a lot of interest  :)

nakeyer

Thank you a lot for example!
Sounds are really very good!
Can you please tell about details - is it VST? Is it Sound bank? In what format? What is it's size and it's resolution (...bit and ...kHz)
Thank you one more time!

Dan

It is not a VST, it is a special synth with special features that you can use in vArranger only. The size is more than 6GB of samples for most 16 Bit , 44,1Hhz

nakeyer

#8
Thank you!
But is it possible to read more details about "special features"? Does your "special synth" support XG format (reverb, chorus, DSPs, banks of instruments, NRPN, etc..) and what about support of XG format SYSEXs?
Does you synth have ins-file? Is it possible to look on it in order to get know the 'content' of the synth - what banks and what sounds it has?
What controllers from XG format 'understand' your "special synth"?
And so on...
To say, it's really sad about the word "special". Is it really impossible to use your synth for playback midi files using vanBasco's Karaoke Player for example, or to use it for MIDI output in CakeWalk?..
And one more question :) - please can you playback this MIDI file using your synth https://cloud.mail.ru/public/4dqD%2F35VaytbHe
make the MP3 file and share it here?
It would be nice to compare the sounds with the synth I have on the same MIDI material.
In order to understand the sound with NRPN job it would be also interesting to hear the MP3 record of this short MIDI file:
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/4v5P%2F4P82DooZ8

.. And (Really sorry for annoying!!  :'( ) for the last.. As you are the great specialist in this matter - on your opinion - what software synths for vArranger can take the second and the third place  ;) meaning your one is the best!

Thank you a lot!

Dan

#9
The vArranger synth has many good features like reverb, chorus, fx3, banks of instruments, with multitimbral fast sound switching, and support many XG NRPN and sysex read from the Yamaha styles
You can actually use your own vst fx for the reverb, chorus or FX3
We support EQ on each track, most drums editing per note, pitch shifting when you change chords, arabic scales, etc...

This synth is completely integrated in vArranger and has not be created to be an external MIDI sound module
vArranger can play midifiles and record WAV FLAC or MP3
You can use your own SF2 or SFZ file to create your own SoundBank for vArranger
The "Yamaha" bank has more than 1000 sounds on it, we also have soundbanks for Korg Roland and Ketron

I am working now on adding Delay DSP, and kind of disk streaming engine to it, and more later....

We are always adding new features. The soundbanks are our work to help users to have better compatibility with most of styles but is not a true Yamaha / Korg / Roland / Ketron synth

Let me know if you have a specific XG feature question

Our synth is not the best, but is the best for vArranger :)

Then we usually add few VST instruments for the right hand like good piano sound, organ emulation, etc...

nakeyer

#10
Hmm.. Let's say that your synth is the best! I found it really very good! The process of adding VSTs for the right hand has no limit for sure :) but the 'root' sound of whole composition is to your synth!!

You said about 6 Gb of samples.. Do you mean it is the one big Sound Bank for Yamaha / Korg / Roland / Ketron synth? Or it is some 'special' bank for Yamaha?
What do you mean by "disk streaming engine" for vArranger?

I wrote this one:
"...In order to understand the sound with NRPN job it would be interesting to hear the MP3 record of this short MIDI file with your synth:
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/4v5P%2F4P82DooZ8 "

but if you say you can use your synth only with vArranger (it's really strange for me, but let it be so!) - I understand you can not do that... It's a pity..
I made the recording of this MIDI file using the XG software synth I have. Here it is
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/28zu%2F5wD5A3ywh
with the example of NRPN for guitar...

Why I am asking about all this.. Maybe you know there is rather good sound library of samples of Yamaha s900 for Kontakt. Samples are really very good and sounds the same as the real Yamaha PSR S900, but ... they are only samples without 'understanding' such things as NRPNs for example and other things from XG standard. Sure I can add some addition VST with DSPs.. But it is a headache a bit :)

nakeyer

Hi Dan!
Is it possible to buy vArranger without any "special synth with special features"?
Thank you!

Dan

I have tried your midifile, and it has indeed a low pass filter frequency nrpn
I have added support of this NRPN in next version of vArranger
However the filter effect is not actually as deep as yours. Mostly because we have in vArranger value = 64 = No changes of the filter, but in Yamaha it seems to be full range
I need to check it a bit more, before recording.

vArranger came with the synth for free. However the SoundBanks are a separate purchase.

nakeyer

Thank you for attention to my questions!

Really Yamaha XG format has many interesting features!.. But what I am talking about - you know them in more details than me..

Meanwhile thinking about good XG software syth I tried to found VST XG Synth which could 'understand' XG features (XG SYSEXs, DSPs, Controllers, RPNs, NRPNs, etc..) I think it is rather important for Yamaha styles.

So I found this one that can be used as the separate VSTi plugin with any MIDI software I want. And another one dignity - it's size is about 1Gb. So I can use it with my 2Gb RAM tablet.. :) And at last - it is absolutely FREE! ;)

Here is the examples of sounds. Sorry - I didn't adjust tracks mixing...
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/3x5P%2F5wXY9frwU

I will think about purchasing vArranger!
Have a nice day!

Dan


nakeyer

#15
Nice you like it!  :)
It was made by Russian programmers. They named it "TyRus"  ;)
The process of creating is not finished, soon there will be the next version.
The last version (from May) you can download here:
https://yadi.sk/d/NE5m8i9QLwZ9Ew
They included the Savihost into the folder with TyRus to use it also as standalone synth.
Pay attention that this synth (dll-file) is for 32bit Windows. So not all 64bit hosts can 'see' it (for example the x64 version of Cantabile can not). To say - BandLab CakeWalk can 'see'!
You can check this synth with any XG editor (XGWorks for example).
The discussing staff about this synth is here:
https://vk.com/yamaha_vsti
You can join it for sure. The persons who makes this synth are very pleasant persons!
Hope I help you!
Have a nice day!


Dan

Ok, I think this is using the standard Yamaha S-YXG50 VST that have been hacked to be able to load with different samples. Someone did the hard work here : https://veg.by/en/projects/syxg50/

nakeyer

Yes, they are the same guys who did it!  :)
They continue their work on the other web.page I've gave you.
It's very interesting to know your comments about their work!...

Dan

I have tried the synth. It has some nice sounds inside, and it sounds overall good with the new version of vArranger.
It seems they have sampled various instruments like the Yamaha XF
Maybe they can release a SF2 or SFZ version of their sounds, so it can be used directly in vArranger 64 bit too. No need of this limiting VST
By the way, I have found most of XG sysex seems to not react with this VST synth
Maybe they have started from SGP2 (XG Lite) instead of S-YXG50 that has a lot more DSP inside
By the way it is technically incredible to hack the Yamaha synth this way ! Congratulations for the work. Not sure if Yamaha will like it :)

nakeyer

#19
Not only Yamaha XF but also Tyros and some PSRs!
And hi!  ;) Yamaha will say no word, because those Russians made much better software synth!  :) And.. for FREE!!!  :P
I think it will be interesting for you to contact with these guys. They will tell you about many interesting things to make vArranger much better and.. much cheaper  :D
They also looks for programmers to make TyRus better. May be you will find each other!

P.S. I tried TyRus with XGWorks and seems nearly all DSPs works! Don't forget that soon they will upload the new version of TyRus and they say it will be much better :)