Varranger vs Tyros/PSR950

[sjmarano]

I'm new to this forum, and new to arranger-style hardware/software in general, so I apologize
in advance if this question has been asked/answered before.  And if so,  feel free to point me to
an existing thread...

I'm getting back into keyboards for home studio use after a prolonged absence.
I've got a Motif XF8 and a Yamaha KX61 (MIDI controller), and I want to complement them with an arranger-style keyboard.
I've been looking at a Tyros 4 or possibly the new Yamaha PSR-S950,  but someone suggested
that I consider Varranger2 and couple it with the KX61/Motif as a far more cost effective
way to accomplish the same thing.   

So I have two really basic questions: 
First, can I essentially duplicate the functionality of the Tyros with Varranger2 in conjunction with this keyboard combination?
Second,  I've got a pretty good collection of soft synth and sample-based VSTs (e.g. Omnisphere, Kontakt).
Would these be effective for use in conjunction with Varranger, or should I consider picking up the SD2?

Any help/advice with above would be greatly appreciated.

Steve in Jersey

[Bernie9]

Hi Steve

Since you are looking for arranger functions to compliment your Motif, a 4K Tyros 4 is an extreme overkill in my opinion.  The new Yammy S950 is closer, but you are limited to Yamaha sounds in that keyboard.

I have an Audya and KN7000 as main boards, as well as vArranger, and I can tell you vArranger can perform all of the essential arranger functions as well.  The bonus is that you can play Ketron, Yamaha, and Roland styles at a fraction of the cost, with vArranger and an SD2 or 4. Some members have used vst's, but you have to deal with latency and config.

The other reason is that you already know controllers and the obvious advantages and disadvantages over an all in one keyboard.  vArranger is open ended, on the other hand, as Dan is constantly adding new functions.

I vote for vArranger and SD2.

Bernie

[Dan]

Hi Steve,

Bernie is right

In a first try, you can start with only vArranger without the Ketron SD2, and use your Motif XF as a midi sound module.

If your main use is Home Studio and not Live music, vArranger can help you greatly to create a base for your recordings with the song chords feature.
http://www.varranger.fr/vforum/index.php?topic=218.0

You select a Tyros style, enter some chords, and the export the song to midifile.

Then you can start with this midifile on your DAW (cubase, protools...) as a basis for your new song, improving it with some VSTi and audio/midi tracks.

Let us know if you have more questions.

[sjmarano]

Thanks, Dan and Bernie.
I do have a few more questions. 
Dan, under different circumstances I would probably just call you, as it would
be a lot more efficient and quicker to get through these questions that way,  but I'm guessing you live in France (grin)...

1 - I realized after I sent the first e-mail that Varranger only works under Windows?
Ironically,  while I have been a Windows user for several decades,  I purchased my first MacBook Pro (late 2011 version)
earlier this year and have purchased/installed OSX music software basically to avoid the hassle of finding the right combination
of Windows-based MIDI and audio interfaces (the old 'it just works' on the Mac side).   I've got Yamaha's FW16e fireware MIDI/audio
interface card installed to connect with the MacBook and it's been working really well for me. So couple of questions:
  a - I'm guessing I would have to run Varranger under Bootcamp, or possibly VMWare?   
If so,  do you know if there will be any complications this might cause?  Last thing I want to do
is have to purchase an audio interface board for the Mac, given that the Motif card has been working so well.
  b - Any preference for running Varranger under Windows XP vis a vis Windows 7 under Bootcamp?

2 - Bernie states there might be latency problems if I use my VSTs.   Is that likely to be true with the above MacBook configuration?

3 - This is more a MacBook question than anything:  I've currently got Omnisphere, Synthogy (great piano)  and Kontakt sample libraries installed on a separate partition in my MacBook.  If I create a Windows partition under Bootcamp and install the Omnisphere/Synthogy/Kontakt run-time programs there, can they access the sample libraries on the separate partition?  Or do I have to install a completely separate and duplicate set of samples to run under Windows?

4 - I'm guessing I could eliminate a lot of hassle with VSTs and having to install multiple versions of software if I simply use the sounds in my Motif, and possibly supplement them with a sound module like the SD2.   I'm curious how the SD2 compares in sound quality to the Motif, and more importantly to the Tyros or PSR-S910/950?   Are the sounds comparable in quality to what's in the Audya?  Anything else you'd recommend in a similar sound module price range?   

5 - One thing I thought about doing was to purchase Varranger and possibly Korg's new Krome keyboard as an alternative to purchasing
a Tyros 4 or even the new PSR-S950.  Would be significantly less expensive and more versatile.    Any thoughts on how the Krome
(it's basically a Korg M50 with far better piano samples) might work out with Varranger?

6 - Last, and I guess I could best answer this by downloading and trying out the Varranger demo:  I am under impression that it's a
PITA to modify Yamaha styles to access alternative sounds, which obviously is what I would have to do in order to use Varranger
with my Motif.   How difficult is this to do using Varranger?   

Again, sorry for the number of questions.  Dan, if it's easier for you to respond to these via phone,
I'd be happy to call you at a time that's convenient.  Just let me know.

Steve Marano

[Dan]

1a - Yes vArranger is Windows only. I personally use a MacBookPro with BootCamp who is working very well.
vmware will probably add some latency, but I never tested it.
I don't understand why you need to buy another audio interface.
1b - Windows 7 under Bootcamp !

2 - No. Latency depends on your audio card drivers. Most ASIO audio cards are working ok with very low latency.

3 - Mmm... In my case, the Mac partition was formatted with HFS, and the Windows partition was NTFS. Windows can read the mac partition, but can't write on it.
There is a tools called MacDrive who allows you to write on the Mac partition from Windows, but I think this tools will add latency.

4. The SD2 and the Motif sounds are very different. SD2 sounds are not that clean and perfect than the Yamaha. But the sound is more live. My favorites sounds on the SD2 are drums, bass, accordion, brass, sax, flute, clarinet, electric pianos, guitars, strings sounds. The SD2 will allow the 'perfect' compatibility when playing Ketron styles.
Most of the sounds of the Audya are from the SD2. They added new sounds too...
We are all waiting the SD1000 from Ketron, who was announced but still not released

5 - Korg Krome should work with vArranger.

6 - Here is how to do:
First find the INS file containing the list of the sounds of your synth.
Then you click on INS to see the sound list. Then, you can click on each of the 16 tracks, and select the sound you like.
Then save the style with the sounds selected.
I just attached here the motif XF INS file, and a screenshot of how it is presented on vArranger.

Let me know if you have more questions. I am sure that other musicians are reading your questions here with interest

Dan

[sjmarano]

thanks Dan for the responses.   Seems like the logical thing for me to do is to try the demo, as for me the key factor will be figuring out whether / how to set up a Windows version of my software.
Is there a link to where I can download, and could you briefly describe differences between demo and full version?
Thank you for your quick responses!

[Dan]

There is no demo version of vArranger, but if you are sure that you want to use vArranger, you can buy it, and if something is not working correctly, I will refund you back. We can continue by private emails for details.

[sjmarano]

Understand.  I was going off of some old (2010) threads where individuals were asking about
getting a copy of 'the demo.'

Key for me then before the purchase is to set up Windows on the MacBook and see how
things go with copying over the key music software I use (Cubase,  VSTs, etc.) to the Windows environment.
If that goes well,  then I'd make the purchase.

Two quick last questions:

- I assume when I purchase,  your on-line ordering can handle conversion from Euros to dollars?
And could you tell me what the current price would be in dollars?

- You said that you're using a Mac running Windows.  Which OS would you recommend?
I was thinking of going with Windows 7 in 32 bit edition because that should give most flexilibity (I think).
Would you agree?  I could go Windows XP or Windows 7 64-bit.

Steve Marano

[Dan]

Yes, since 2010, I had some problems with demo versions, and had to stop creating new limited demo versions.

Take your time to build your system, then come back to me.

The EURO to USD conversion will depend on the day you buy it and will be done automatically by your bank/Paypal. I have no control over this.

For me, the best os is Windows 7.  They improved things with the multitasking since Windows XP, and I find Win 7 more stable + more options for playing low latency audio without need of installing a pro audio card.

Some people said that Windows 8 (to be released on October 26th) will be even better... So maybe wait for the new Windows 8?

If you go for the 32 bit, Windows will only recognize 3GB of ram max.
vArranger is working fine on 32 bit and 64 bit OS.

The question will be for the other softwares, like if your VST host is 64 bits, 32bits VST plugins will not work without adding some software in between)

Also, you have to check on your hardware's website (korg, yamaha...), if drivers exists for 64bits, and soon for Windows 8.

So... go for Windows 7 x64 if you want something good, and if you are sure that all your softwares / drivers are available.
If you are more adventurous, wait for Windows 8 release, and wait for some users testing information about installing Windows 8 with bootcamp, and about Windows 8 drivers.

Dan

[sjmarano]

Thanks for all the advice, Dan.
I've got some configuring and experimenting to do and then will be back.
Good luck in your own ventures...