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sys ex to audya

Started by angel1000, July 11, 2012, 09:01:59 PM

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angel1000

Hello guys for Dan or anyone that can answer me. I realize one cannot wait for Dan to do everything, so I am trying on my own. Can I use the sys ex messages from the footswitch fs13 to control for example the fills variations etc. I want to put the sys ex messages into a sequencer will the audya be triggered. I would imagine the sys ex messages to run the sd2 are different than the Audya? How much work would it take to put sys ex messages  for fills variations intro ending into the varranger.Is anyone else interested in this idea for the varranger to control the audya, To begin with simply recognizing chords in a style. I would also imagine Dan you are the only one who programs varranger?

Dan

I don't really understand. What do you want to do?
Ask one question only, and I will answer to one question :)

jan1kow

Maybe I also dont understand but.
I dont really think the your footpedals sends sysex messages.
They send small power/current changes to make a switsh open/closed for fills?
I think you need anothe rUSB pedal device for fills.
Analogue to USB conversion pedals are discussed in another thread in this forum group. 
jon
uk

Dan

It depends if you want to plug the FS13 pedal to vArranger or to Audya

pax_eterna

The Behringer FCB1010 can send a sysex data message from a pedal and can be edited for any such data...but as far as I can rememebr the FS pedals from ketron are hardwired to transmit ONLY a specific SYSex message to control specific functions on the SD series and the Audya series, of an Midjays as well..

Jan these footswitches are a step or two up from the standard "flip-flops" . Like the basic sustain pedal, or similar that work in the manner you outlined.

The Korg EC5 is another example of a manufacturer specific pedal that transmits specific data and not just CV messages.

If Dan can set the variations in vA to react to a sysex instead of a CC, then theoretically the FS footswitches would work....but I suspect he would need to re-write many lines of code for this to work successfully in vA.

Angel, if you get a pedal like the FCB1010 then you can use it via the "midi learn" feature Dan has thoughtfully incorporated into vA, but I repeat, as the FS pedals from Ketron are "Hard-Wired" for specific data (ie ONLY sysex, and not CC) then they would not work in the manner in which I "think" you are hoping for.

Especially with the new UNO chip, which enables the FCB to be used more as a traditional " stompbox"

angel1000

I wish to know if the sys ex messages from the pedal can be used for example in a sequencer to trigger the variations or fills in a style. Can I use the sys ex messages I found for the fs13 on the audya. Are they the same messages if for example I put the in Varranger. Example:                                              F0 26 79 03 footswitch status F7:   can I use those sys ex messages to trigger what I want.

angel1000

Thanks Pax for the info. I will try to be more clear. I am not interested in the pedal, I am interested in what it sends. Can I send those messages myself, are they the right messages to trigger variation a b c or fills etc. For example when you press variation A on the audya. Is the pressing of the button sending a similiar sys ex you would get if you sent it by the pedal

Dan

I think NO.
I think that the pedals are sending the same message whatever the function it is assigned on the audya.

If someone is interrested, I am building some Ketron FS6 / FS13 to USB (usb midi) adapters, to be able to plug the Ketron pedals to control vArranger

angel1000

In the midjay manual, manual sys ex messages and messages from the pedal were the same. Are you saying that the message from the pedal to control for example variation a is not the same message when I press the button variation a on the audya.     

angel1000

Is this adaptor going to make me control the audya through varranger.

Dan

The same pedal can be used to turn off the microphone or to change variation.
I think that the pedal is sending always the same message, but not sure.... have to check it...


No, this adaptor will allow you to control any function of vArranger by foot

angel1000

Dan,How would you control,from Varranger, the audya styles variations, fills,intros etc, you would need to know the sys ex messages is that correct. If it is correct are the footswitch sys ex those messages or are there other messages that I am not aware of.

Dan

Here are the System Exclusive messages to control the Audya's variations etc...

angel1000

Yes Dan that is from the manual, the only place I see variations a,b c, fills, intros, sys ex messages is at the footswitch section. So are those the sys ex messages universally, or are they the sys ex messages to control the parameters just from the footswitch

angel1000

sys ex message for arranger c is F0 26 79 03 05h 0 f7    is that correct

Dan

Maybe this :

F0 26 79 03 05 7F f7   = pedal pressed ARR C
F0 26 79 03 05 00 f7   = pedal switch release

angel1000

would it be a lot of work to have varranger a,b,c d, intro end 1,2,3 fill1,2,3,4, trigger these on the Audya. I am assuming that when you put these in the chord view arranger they are sys ex messages. I would imagine I also need midi sync and export to midifile.

were you able to look at the link

Dan

When you select variations A B C D.... on the song chords window of vArranger, it will ONLY tell to vArranger that it need to select the variation.

vArranger then PLAYS the style and sends the right midi notes to the sound module.

What you want to do is Audya IS Playing the style, and vArranger is only sending the chords and variations change in sync with the audya.

Maybe I will add that feature that if you select MIDI OUT 1 SYNC and you SELECT the AUDYA mode on vArranger, and maybe a special style, THEN, I will add the sysex to control the Audya.

I have to try it.

angel1000

Thanks Dan let me know its progress. I wonder if there is anyone else who owns an audya that would like those functions triggered by varranger. I basically need this for my recording studio to build backing tracks.

PatSar63

Hi Dan,

I just read in a previous topic that you know how adding hardware component to a FS13 pedal to be used with both Audya and USB. I'm very interested in it.
Do you sell such a cable ?

Anyway, I'm still insterested in driving the Audya arranger stuff thoughout vA2 because the vA2 arranger is more complete and very efficient. Also, it would allow to use vA2-SD2 sounds (left and right) that I consider best than the Audya's ones and it could be easier to balance the sound level between the solo instrument and the style volume.

Regards
Patrick

Dan

Hi Patrick,

Yes, I am creating and selling many MIDI/USB custom hardware component. If you want a FS13 to USB adaptor, you will be my first client.

I just tried to send sync clock to the Audya, and set the Audya Sync In at ON, but it does not react to the midi clock signal !
The 100$ Yamaha PSR was working ok.

Anyone knows how to set the Audya so it will work with the sync in?

Dan

angel1000

Hi Dan are if you are referring to the manual it is on page 91 of the long manual. It is the Midi Utility Window

louguit

Pour connecter un pédalier FS13 KETRON en USB à un PC il est nécessaire de fabriquer une petite interface.
Le circuit existe, il faut simplement le mettre en boite et réaliser les soudures.
Je l'ai fait, ça marche et on en a parlé ici :

To connect a crankset FS13 KETRON in USB to a PC, it is necessary to make a small interface.
The circuit exists, it is simply necessary to put it in box and to realize the welds.
I made it, that works and we spoke about it here:
http://keyboards.leforum.eu/t3732-Comment-connecter-un-FS13-a-un-PC-en-USB.htm?q=fs13+usb&start=30

Cordialement

angel1000

Dan you are more the expert than I am. I will offer whatever I know. I read on synthzone you did it through the usb. Is it possible it has to be done through the midi port.

angel1000

trying to find a solution , would seem impossible that you can't sync. How about Midi utilities  button F6 USB Midi Out has to be turned on. If it is not turned on, I guess it will work from ordinary midi ports. I hope we can get this working. Anyone out there if they have any answers.

Dan

1- For FS13 to USB, look at the pictures here http://www.varranger.fr/vforum/index.php/topic,753.0.html

2- When I connect the Audya to PC with the USB cable, and of course set USB MIDI ON, the MIDI CLOCK IN simply does not work
- When I use standard MIDI Cables to AUDYA MIDI IN 2 (keyb) and let the MIDI PORT IN KEYB 2, the syncro is working but ONLY WITH STANDARD PATTERNS

If you select a style with audio drums, the style is not in sync at all

So there is 2 bugs in Audya : MIDI CLOCK IN does not work with the USB cable and does not work with audio styles


angel1000

Hi Dan,that is not good news. I found an old email of AJ , jay@ketronus.com. Also since you are part of synthzone i think you can send him a personal message. I am hoping you'll be able to get some answers and fix these bugs. Keep us informed.

                                                  Angelo

angel1000

All right Dan I will reply in this forum. Do you know anything about the midi remix function. It seems you can import a midi file  (export to midi varranger), you can then change the drum track in midi with an internal audya style even with the audio drums, and you can also change the guitar track  to audio guitars.

Dan

Jay and AJ are 2 different person, and I know them from Internet.
I am not sure they can do anything about the bugs in Audya. For this you have to ask to the factory      ....@ketron.it

I don't know about the remix function in Audya. But can it drive the Audya styles with chord changing according to the midifile?

angel1000

The remix  function can change the drums, guitar track in a midifile, and replace it with a drum and guitar from any style. I made an appointment to go and see someone from Italmelodie (canadian distributor for Ketron) he says the audya can be driven by a miditrack with chords, and it will drive the complete style. If you are interested I'll let you know what turns up.

Dan


pax_eterna

Quote from: angel1000 on July 19, 2012, 04:05:46 PM
The remix  function can change the drums, guitar track in a midifile, and replace it with a drum and guitar from any style. I made an appointment to go and see someone from Italmelodie (canadian distributor for Ketron) he says the audya can be driven by a miditrack with chords, and it will drive the complete style. If you are interested I'll let you know what turns up.

As far as I can remember from my Midjay days, this is controlled by a sysex message in the OS to load in the part in question. Any arranger can be driven by chords from an external source. As long as it is MIDI and the receiving device can have a NTA setting (this is Note To Arranger)...then no problem thos chord notes will get sent to the arranger engine...it is a little more complicated than JUST sending chord note data via midi, as the receiving device must have OS code to interpret that for the NTT tables and other things...Otherwise it thinks it is getting just a whole bunch of notes, and will just play them as whatever sound is assigned to that channel.

Rolands Yamahas and Korgs can all have an NTA set...as far as I can remember the SD1 + could as well...but the Audya is unknown to me.

angel1000

See pax we don't always disagree, I'm listening to what you're saying. Just came back from the Canadian Distributor for ketron. No one is technical enough, and the technical people i can't get in contact with them. Si I am throwing in the towel.

Dan

Pax, the problem is not to control the arranger, but to control it IN TIME.
You PLAY your midifile on the pc, playing the chords recorded in a sequencer for example at 120 BPM and then the arranger will play the style and stay in sync with the PC

angel1000

Ya pax the remix function has no chords involved,it is just replacing the midifile drum track and guitartrack with the internals from Audya, Audya does all the recognition by itself. About the chords having a note to arranger function I guess you are right, because all we got at the distributor was midi notes, no changing of style

angel1000

Well Dan if you ever make something like what I want, let me know, in the meantime I will not be bothering you about that feature anymore.

pax_eterna

Quote from: Dan on July 19, 2012, 07:03:30 PM
Pax, the problem is not to control the arranger, but to control it IN TIME.
You PLAY your midifile on the pc, playing the chords recorded in a sequencer for example at 120 BPM and then the arranger will play the style and stay in sync with the PC

Agreed, BUT the receiving device (arranger) MUST receive this data over the NTA channel (or Control channel - as Korg calls it) for those incoming notes to actually drive the chord recognition engine..

One thing to remember, Ketrons (afaik) have NEVER allowed incoming midi clock control, it has always been outwards only as a master.....

pax_eterna

Quote from: angel1000 on July 19, 2012, 07:00:19 PM
See pax we don't always disagree, I'm listening to what you're saying. Just came back from the Canadian Distributor for ketron. No one is technical enough, and the technical people i can't get in contact with them. Si I am throwing in the towel.

;D  no probs angel, all meant in the nicest way, no disrespect or offence meant.

angel1000

Ya I'm just having fun pax, two people who like to debate. If what you say is true, ketron likes only to be a master, it explains all the problems we are having. Too bad it would have been a glorious sd2. I went to listen to one this afternoon wasn't as wowed  as i've been in the past. I guess because the varranger comes close.

angel1000

got an email from ketron italy, and if it is any help. they answered the midi sync is to record an audio file synchronized to a midi file. The file must be on the hard disk and not on the USB. Let me know if this helps, if there is any interest, and if you want me to say anything to ketron Italy.

Dan

This not answers our questions.
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