Author Topic: One Computer Installation Policy  (Read 21273 times)

Offline paulus1971

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One Computer Installation Policy
« on: July 09, 2014, 12:00:30 AM »
Hi Dan,

I'm very impressed with varranger, and really would like to buy it.

But before buying it, i would like to know about few things.

I just bought a Yamaha MOXF, and I really want to buy your varranger. So, this year i don't have a spare budget to buy new laptop.

My questions are :
1. If i buy varranger and then install it in my Asus A43E (i3, 2 GB RAM, 500 HDD), then later on i want to buy a better laptop with 
    touch screen. Can i install the varranger in the new laptop?
2. Can varranger play Yamaha PSR style well if I use Yamaha MOXF as the sound generator for varranger?
3. Can i use a midi pedal to control : Fill-Ins, Mains, Endings? So that i don't need to use my hand to do so?

Thank you for your help
« Last Edit: July 09, 2014, 12:03:54 AM by paulus1971 »

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2014, 07:33:07 AM »
Hello Paulus,

Did you get my private answer?

1. Yes. you will need to contact me later for licence transfer.

2. Yes. Not all styles will sound ok, but many will.
Listen to some demo of vArranger + MOXF in GM mode here :
http://www.varranger.com/vforum/index.php/topic,68.msg12785.html#msg12785

3. Yes

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2014, 09:37:07 AM »
Unfortunately i haven't received your private answer....thank you anyway

I have few more questions, sorry about this :
1. The demo with MOXF on youtube is really impressive, sounds very good. Is the demo produced by vArranger without 
    tuning/tweaking?
2. If I want to edit styles' individual instruments, will vArranger enable me to use MOXF preset voices other than MOXF general
    midi voices? Or vArranger will only allow me to use MOXF GM voices?  (cause i have long dreamed to have a live arranger with
    sound qualitiy close to yamaha motif's sound)
3. Do you have yamaha MOXF .INS file?

Thank you Dan.

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2014, 10:04:56 AM »
1. Yes no tweaking

2. I think yes. You need to be in SONG/multitrack mode, where you can play 16 different sounds on the 16 midi tracks. You can't use performance sounds that use already many channels

3. Here is the Motif XF INS file. Not sure if it own the same sound set as the MOXF : http://www.varranger.com/vforum/index.php/topic,479.msg6465.html#msg6465

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2014, 06:50:30 AM »
Hi Dan,

I just purchased your vArranger today.

I tried to get the Motif XF .ins file you mentioned in your reply, but I can't find any link or attachment file which I can click to download. How long will it take to get the vArranger software?

Thank you
« Last Edit: July 10, 2014, 11:40:49 AM by Dan »

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2014, 07:30:58 AM »
About Installation using USB Flashdisk,


Does it mean that i can use vArranger on any computer as long as the usb key is attached to the computer?

In this scenario, if the USB Flashdisk is lost, what should I do?

Thank you

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2014, 11:44:34 AM »
Hello Paulus,

Thank you for your new purchase, and welcome to vArranger

I just sent you an email. Did you get it?

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2014, 11:53:25 AM »
I have just opened for you the Download section of vArranger.
There is tons of good styles and bonus files.
You will now be able to download the INS file of the XF

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2014, 12:32:02 PM »
Hi Dan,

Thank you for your quick response Dan.

Waiting impatiently to try the vArranger      ;D


Cheers

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2014, 12:50:02 PM »
While waiting,

I'm now downloading tons of very useful files that can be used with vArranger

Thank you Dan

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2014, 12:22:44 AM »
I have already installed vArranger, thank you Dan.

I have few questions :
1. After I edit some styles (changing the sound, tempo, etc....),  then save them. Where are the edited styles saved?
2. Is it possible to split right hand and left hand?
3. When I play fast styles, whenever my right hand plays melody on chord (4 notes at once) and does the rhythmic comping as well, then my left hand
    does the chord comping as well, then the style tempo will be dragging.....Then I tried to turn off all the accompaniment voices except Drum, and
    Bass, while my right and left hand do chord comping, the tempo stills keeps dragging. I don't think it is caused by MOXF polyphony, because when I
    play my MOXF in performance mode (not using vArranger) and use the same playing style, there is no problem with the tempo at all. Could you tell
    what causes it?

I think I will have many more questions to ask later on.........please bear with me    :)

Thank you

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2014, 12:29:17 AM »
1. All saving are going into a second file close to the style. For example Rock.STY  will save into Rock.STY2
2. By default, vArranger is splited.  Your master keyboard need to send in midi channel 1, with no splits.  If you press the button FULL KEYBOARD (top right) then it will not be splited anymore.
3. What is your PC configuration?

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2014, 02:13:28 AM »
I'm using Laptop ASUS A43S.

CPU  :  i3 2310M
RAM  : 2GB
HDD  : 500 GB
OS    : Win 7 Professional - 32 bit

So, is the edited style saved in USB flashdisk, or in the Laptop?

Thank you

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2014, 03:28:04 AM »
When you do SAVE SONG, the style is copied into the folder 'MY SONGS', or any name of folder that you type.
The exact path of the style is then placed in the vArrangerData folder, close to the vArranger2 program
To go to this location, click on the MY SONG title label, and then go to... or right click on any song categories

About the tempo problem, can you send me a picture screen of your vArranger when it come?

Can you try to put your computer power settings in PERFORMANCE MODE?

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2014, 04:34:29 AM »
Hi Dan  (Effect problems),

Thank you for your quick response

Whenever I edited effects for Right Hand 1 and 2nd Hand,  then saved them to the songs (with all parameters checked), the effects knobs will always go to :
1. Right Hand 1 :
             a. Red knob    : always go to maximum (5 o'clock pm direction)
             b. Green knob : always go to minimum  (7 o'clock am direction)
2. 2nd Hand :
             a. Red knob    : always go to middle position (12 o'clock direction)
             b. Green knob : always go to minimum  (7 o'clock am direction)
3. Others Parts' effect knobs are editable (can be saved and recalled in the same state when they were saved previously), only those 2 parts are   
    having problems with editing
And this problem is occuring when I chose GM mode.

Then I tried other modes (GM2, Ketron SD2, etc), those 2 parts' effect knobs are still giving the same problem but with different knobs positions.

Thank you.
 

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2014, 05:00:46 AM »
In vArranger, you can create a new sound (up to 5 layers), then SAVE RIGHT SOUND

This new sound can be used anytime. Just select the RIGHT track , close to the master fader

You can drag & drop this sound in the MY SOUNDS bar.

Then when you SAVE SONG, you can ask to recall this sound for right hand, and recall the full my sounds bar for every style.

So, remember, you can't save every parameters of right tracks with the SAVE SONG, but you can SAVE SOUND, and then load a sound with a style.


I think the best mode for MOXF is XG mode, but never tried it.

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2014, 05:11:19 AM »
Problem with dragging tempo SOLVED


When I chose GM mode for midi out, there is no problem with the tempo anymore.

I will try your instructions about saving the right hand voice


Thank you for your very quick response.

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2014, 12:33:44 PM »
It is very strange, maybe you can send me an email with a mp3 file for me to listen to what you call "dragging tempo"

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2014, 12:37:28 PM »
Hi Dan,

I've been trying to give effects on Right Hand Part, but always fail.

Could you tell me how can I give effects on Right Hand Part?

For Yamaha MOFX, the best mode is GM. Coz i've just found that MOXF doesn't have XG, only GM and Preset sounds.

Thank you.

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #19 on: July 11, 2014, 12:50:22 PM »
XG mode is adding a smoother chord transition, but I am not sure if the MOXF is compatible with smooth chord transition without listening to someone playing the MOXF & vArranger and changing chords.

Do you get Reverb and Chorus? they are simply sending CC91 & CC93.
(For chorus, there is a line under the 2 knobs with ---.  Click on it, and set Chorus.
You can also send FX3 = CC94 when you double click on any track, and set the FX3 knob.


Then.... It really depend on how the MOXF will react to those messages. Maybe you need to set the DSP in the MOXF, to the effect you want?

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2014, 01:33:30 PM »
Sorry for not making myself clear enough...
 
Actually, I can get Revert and Chorus, and be able to save the effects given to the sounds I want.

But I can't get any delay effect to work. I don't know why.

Another question : Why the bass transpose doesn't work? So, anytime i change the bass sound with different sound, the bass sound was way too low

Thank you for your quick response

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2014, 01:43:05 PM »
You maybe need to set a DELAY inside the MOXF as a system FX, and assign the FX level parameter to the Midi CC94

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #22 on: July 11, 2014, 02:53:16 PM »
So what is happening actually is :

I'm now using MOX .ins file I downloaded from you. Because, actually Preset bank 1 to bank 8 of MOX and MOXF are both identical. So I can now choose any MOXF sounds from Preset 1 to Preset 8 (that is more than 1000 sounds, really cool!!) to replace any instruments of the accompaniment section, as well as choosing any preset sounds (not GM sound anymore) for the Right Hand Part.

But, the thing is, whenever I choose a sound for Right Hand Part, for example, E. Piano Phaser (the original sound of the preset sound has Stereo Phaser effect),  the Phaser effect is gone. So, the sound will become a plain E. Piano.

Another example....when I choose Guitar with Delay effect (when I play this sound in VOICE mode of MOXF the guitar sound has delay effect) for Right Hand Part, the delay effect is simply gone...so the guitar sound becomes a plain guitar sound.

I have to use vArranger in Song mode right? Because only in SONG mode the MOXF has multitimbral ability. But the funny thing is, whenever I use vArranger in Song mode, all the instruments will be played by 1 sound only, and by default is piano (drum notes, bass notes, guitar notes, etc.... are all produced by piano sound)

So far...what I've been doing is :
1. I have to go to SONG MODE
2. I choose the SONG number, suppose SONG 1
3. Then in Song 1, i have to load and play a good SMF file in GM format first before I can use the Song 1 to play with vArranger, or else the whole style
    will only be played by 1 sound, in my case, it is always a piano sound

Could you please tell me, is it the right thing to use vArranger with a synth or I've been doing it the wrong way?

Thank you Dan.

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #23 on: July 11, 2014, 03:20:53 PM »
Did you already use any recording software, like Cubase, sonar Protools... with the MOXF?

It should be the same in vArranger.

I think you should activate the FX on the channel on the MOXF : note that Right 1/2/3 is Midi channel 13/14/15...
http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/&sa=X&ei=6-GITdQdwpXRAcHw4eQN&ved=0CD8Q6QUoADAF&usg=AFQjCNEG132Es5BkKwYMUOVHMXfCv3J2Hw/viewthread/465959/


You don't have to save any song on your MOXF, because vArranger sends BANK and Program change to MOXF,  on the 16 channels when you load the style/change sound...

Strange...

Is there is some vA users here who own yamaha synth who can help, as I don't have the MOXF?

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #24 on: July 11, 2014, 04:27:04 PM »
Hi Dan, thanks again for your help...

I have just read what you wrote about your experience with motif. I have already initialized all the songs in Song mode to be able to play GM properly.

So, now i can play vArranger with any Song number in SONG MODE without having to load and play midi file first.

But the problem with effect still persists. So, any instrument i choose for the Right Hand Part, will be played without the effects, except some distortion guitar sounds still have distorsion effects, some don't   

Strangely but..... instrument i choose to replace the Style's instruments will still have effects.

I use Cubase that comes with MOXF, in Cubase everything works ok. Supposedly i recorded a piano track, if I change the piano sound with E. Piano Phaser, the Phaser effect is still there.


Could you tell me why is it? Thank you.


Thank you

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #25 on: July 11, 2014, 04:30:23 PM »
and you can put the epiano phaser on channel 13?  +  another guitar sound with delay on channel 14... in song mode?

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #26 on: July 11, 2014, 11:50:46 PM »
Hi Dan, I've found the cause of the problem,

By default, MOXF has 2 master effects : Chorus and Reverb.
Other effects, such as Phaser, Delay, etc....that alters the original sound character of voices are grouped as Insert Effects.

The problem always occurs because whenever i launch vArranger, The INSERT EFFECT switches of Midi Channel 9 - 16 will always be turned off. And strangely I can't turned them ON. They seem to be locked by vArranger somehow.

When I try to play midifile from Cubase, all the INSERT EFFECTs of the 16 Midi Channels are set to ON.

That's the difference, why in Cubase i can use any instrument without altering the preset sound character, whereas in vArranger i can only retain preset sound character of any instruments limited to Channels 1 - 8 only.

Could you help me with this please?

Thank's a lot Dan.


Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #27 on: July 12, 2014, 12:57:11 AM »
EFFECT PROBLEM "SOLVED"...................Sorry Dan, my mistake :

The Maximum Insert Effects that can be used simultaneously in MOXF are only 8.

So, if I want to use Insert Effects in channel 13 - 15, I have to turn off Insert Effects on other Channel first.

So, could you tell me, which midi channels are not used by most styles in vArrangers?

Thank you Dan.
 

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #28 on: July 12, 2014, 09:59:49 PM »
Here are the channels of vArranger. I let you decide which one need insert FX :)

BassChanel = 5

Accomp1 = 6
Accomp2 = 7
Accomp3 = 8
Accomp4 = 11
Accomp5 = 12

Right1 = 13
Right2 = 14
Right3 = 15
Right4 = 16
SecondVoice = 2

Drums1 = 10
Drums2 = 9

Left1 = 3
Left2 = 2
Left3 = 1

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #29 on: July 13, 2014, 01:26:45 PM »
Hi Dan,

Thank you for your info.

I'm trying to connect with Edirol Hyper Canvas (I know that this vst sound quality is not good enough), which is a multitimbral and GM2. When I play any style, it turns out that I have to choose the instrument manually.

I have band in a box software, when I connect it to Hyper Canvas, band in a box can automatically select all the instruments. Is actually vArranger able to do the same thing? Or when we us Multitimbral and GM VST plugin we still have to set up all the instrument manually for every single style?


Thank you

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #30 on: July 13, 2014, 02:04:03 PM »
Hi Dan,

Strange thing is happening. After I connected vArranger with Hyper Canvas, then I used the MOXF as sound generator again, I can't change the intruments of anystyle. But styles still play as they should be. So, when I change styles, my MOXF received midi messages and changed the sound of its channels according to program change message sent by vArranger.

But whenever i want to change the styles' instruments, by clicking the INS button (usually i can change instruments sound to whatever I want), nothing happen (so my MOXF didn't receive any program change message from vArranger).

Could you help me with this?

Thank you

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #31 on: July 13, 2014, 02:32:05 PM »
SOLVED!  Sorry, again....it was my fault    ;D

I forgot to change the mode to GM/XG, so that vArranger did not respond when i tried to change the sound to MOXF preset sounds.

Sorry to give you so many questions Dan.

But, if you can help me with my question about VST, that will be really great!

Thanks a lot

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #32 on: July 13, 2014, 11:49:38 PM »
I have just installed the VST HyperCanvas V1.6
You are right, this VST worked once, then it does not want to change it's sounds anymore.
I think there is a bug in the VST in some conditions...
Are you sure you want to use this VST?  It sounds very bad :)
Did you try the vArranger Software Synth? This a good alternative, and a lot more powerful.
Sounds can be replaced with your own SF2 samples

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #33 on: July 14, 2014, 12:58:35 AM »
Actually i don't want to use Hyper Canvas, the sound is no good.

But for me, to tweak the styles, i have to listen to a reference to know how the style should sound as close as its original sound, regardless the quality.

And after that, i would be able to tweak my MOXF or any VST.

How can I replace sound of vArranger software synth wtih my own SF2 samples?

I tried to record mp3 from styles, but failed, no file saved on the folder i chose. Could you tell me how?

Thank you Dan.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2014, 02:30:32 AM by paulus1971 »

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #34 on: July 14, 2014, 11:21:29 AM »
You can use the vArranger Synth as a "reference"

You can put some SF2 files in the vArrangerData\Sounds\Samples\ folder and run the vArranger2 program

The audio recorder, is only if you use the vArranger Synth, or vArranger VST with WASAPI or ASIO audio

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #35 on: July 15, 2014, 12:47:29 AM »
What's the best setting for vArranger synth? Is it GM/GM2/or.....?

Thank you.

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #36 on: July 15, 2014, 12:48:05 AM »
I usually put GM2

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #37 on: July 15, 2014, 11:36:00 AM »
Hi Dan,

Is vArranger be able to run well on Windows 7 - 64 bit?

My Windows 7 is 32 bit, suddenly the MOXF driver is not working anymore. I want to install my computer with windows 7 - 64 bit, so i that i can install more RAM in my computer.

Thank you

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #38 on: July 15, 2014, 11:40:01 AM »
Yes, but the synth can load for now max 4GB of samples.
So with 64 bit OS and 8GB of ram, you have enough memory for the synth and windows

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #39 on: July 15, 2014, 02:03:56 PM »
Thank you for your quick info Dan,

If i use halion sonic ('cause i like the sound of Halion Sonic SE) as my General Midi VST, then i play few different styles with vArranger. Do i have to adjust the instruments tracks in Halion Sonic for every single style?

Or I can just load and play any style in vArranger, and the tracks in Halion Sonic will call up every corresponding instrument required by vArranger for any style i load and play (just like when i use vArranger software synth)?

Thank you Dan

Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #40 on: July 15, 2014, 02:07:59 PM »
Halion Sonic has a GM mode that once activated will allow the 128 GM sounds to be called by program change.
Unfortunately, even if I sent many emails to steinberg, there is no way for vArranger to ask a drum sound on the channel 9 (perc) SO you need to do it manually...

Offline paulus1971

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #41 on: July 15, 2014, 03:16:27 PM »
Thank you again for your superb quick response Dan,

I've been trying to use Halion Sonic SE hosted in Cubase LE AI 7 (bonus which came with MOXF), with midiLoop, and vArranger. But the program change is only working with drum in channel 10. For other instruments i have to select one by one manually in Cubase.

This is what i am doing :
1. vArranger midi out 1 (GM mode) ----->   Loopmidi channel 0
2. Loopmidi channel 0  ------>  Cubase midi in
3. Cubase audio driver ------>  ASIO
4. Activate Halion Sonic SE vst in Cubase
5. Turn on GM Program Change of Halion Sonic SE vst in Cubase
6. Create 16 midi track in Cubase
7. Set the tracks' channels one by one, and set the midi in for every track to midiLoop channel 0

But...when i play a style from vArranger, only drum track produces the correct sound, other tracks produce either all bass sounds or all piano sounds. Could you please tell me what mistake i have made? I read a post by    xuanvuz  (http://www.varranger.com/vforum/index.php/topic,986.msg8134.html#msg8134) that his hosted vsts can received program change message from vArranger properly.

Could you please help me with this?

Thank you Dan


Offline Dan

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #42 on: July 15, 2014, 03:27:34 PM »
I think Cubase is filtering some incoming midi messages, like program changes.  Look at the Cubase Midi filter menu

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #43 on: July 15, 2014, 10:53:04 PM »
No, it is not the reason. Cubase have not separate midi channel in. Cubase is not right
DAW for that, because by default, Cubase Midi In receive midi masseges allways on all
midi channels (omni), and you need separate midi in channels masseges. But, this can
be solved with use of Cubases Transformer as Input Filter for all of midi tracks. In the
Transformer, you have to filter all other midi channels, exept midi channel which you need
for this midi track.  Only on this way you can use Cubase as VST Host for vArranger2.

One another problem with Halion Sonic SE is, that this Instrument PlugIn can't change
sound programs on Midi Program Change events. Halion Sonic not "understand" PCG
commands, and definitely it is not right VST Instrument for your SetUp (with vArranger).
Halion Sonic is not like Hypersonic. Hypersonic can do this without any problem. Hypersonic
understand very well Midi Program Change Events, but also Midi Bank Changes (LSB) !!!
Unfotunately, problem with Halion Sonic PCG incompatibility can't be solved.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2014, 11:18:57 PM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #44 on: July 15, 2014, 11:35:27 PM »
Thanks a lot AGATON,


In your experience, which VST (with the same quality as Halion Sonic) and which Host can be used with vArranger? Do you think Sonar is a suitable host for this kind of purpose?

Thanks again

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #45 on: July 15, 2014, 11:38:54 PM »
Hi Dan,

When i was trying to choose midi ports, suddenly vArranger crashed. I opened Windows' Start Task Manager, and ended vArranger program.

Then when i try to run vArranger again, nothing happened. It shows "Err_Init : -1"

Could you please help me with this?

Thank you

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #46 on: July 16, 2014, 12:34:03 AM »
Like VST host program you can use "VST Host", it is a free program but very, very stable and very complex.
Another choice is Cantabile Performer, one of the best VST host programs on the market, but very expensive.
In Cantabile you can make Midi Routings and Midi Filters on way you need, everything is possible. I make my
Live Audio Systems with Cantabile as one of programs in a background.

As software Sound Engine you can use for example  Emulator X3 (sampler), or Hypersonic 2 (rompler), but
also NI Kontakt.
All of them can understand Program Change from vArranger2. For setup with NI Kontakt you must have very
big RAM, 16GB or more, and one specially created Kontakt Multi with 16 Instrument Banks and in all of them 128 same
Instruments except Drum and Percussion tracks (midi channels). That need very much memory. In my machines
I use Kontakt as Sound Engine based on Sample Content about 100GB samples. This setup need 12GB of RAM,
sound is amazing and setup with vArranger2 (and many other midi processing programs in background) is 100%
stable. I make this Live Audio systems many years (commercial) and i have tested with many other arrangeur
programs for Windows, but only with vArranger2 (as arranger software, but also as one midi command center)
it is 100% stable and 100% better as any top hardware arranger.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 12:38:08 AM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #47 on: July 16, 2014, 12:50:43 AM »
Thanks a lot again AGATON,

I think i will try the free host first.   is VST Host will be able to make Midi Routings and Midi Filters on way i need as well?

My laptop RAM is only upgradable up to 8 GB. So, i don't think i can use NI Kontakt.

Actually i have MOXF, the sound is quite good, but the master effect functions is very limited. Another thing, MOXF sound is a bit "muddy" even compare to Halion Sonic SE. Halion Sonic SE sounds are cleaner and clearer, but much thinner than MOXF.

Using MOXF as my sound generator with vArranger is really easy, but again, with its limited effect's functions I can create sound staging as good as Halion Sonic SE.

Thank you
« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 12:52:28 AM by paulus1971 »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #48 on: July 16, 2014, 01:18:21 AM »
You can use NI Kontakt also with 8GB RAM but you must be carefully with
sounds with much of sample content. I made Live Audio systems on Laptops
with 8GB RAM based on Kontakt and vArranger2 and it funct !!! But check
first, maybe your Laptop support 16GB RAM it is usual on last generation.

Yes, in "VST Host" you can make all of Midi Routings and Filters what you need.
It is a little bit complicated, but also not so difficult to perform.

Effects in SetUps, for example, with NI Kontakt are much better as in any of
hardware workstations, same thing is also with other VST Sound Engines,
because you can configure your Sound Engine with the best VST Effects,
as AUX, but also as Insert effects. Simply unlimited possibilities, exceptionally
when you have one, so stable,  so powerful, and so flexible program, which
can control, and command all of this thousands sounds and styles in all actual 
and past formats: vArranger2 !!! You will need a little bit time to summarize
all functions and possibilities of vArranger2 and software Sound Engines, and
all of midi routings and filters what you need in specific situations or SetUps,
but than you will see what of powerful "machine" is vArranger2.       
« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 02:26:38 AM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #49 on: July 16, 2014, 03:32:58 AM »
Thank you so much for your information.

So, in your opinion, NI Kontakt is the best sounding VST out there?

Dan suggested that i can try the built in VST of vArranger. My questions are :
1. in term of flexibility and stability, which one is better : using more samples hosted in vArranger Soft Synth or using VST Host hosting NI 
    Kontakt?
2. What's the second best choice for VST in your opinion? Since my laptop can only handle 8 GB of RAM (according to factory spec)?
3. My processor is Intel i3 2310M, do you think it is enough?
4. Do you know the best sounding GM ready VST?


Again, thank you for your help
« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 03:36:58 AM by paulus1971 »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #50 on: July 16, 2014, 08:16:22 AM »
 8)
  Hey Paulus
  No Kontakt cannot be the better choice for vA . But it is a very good soft .
  Indépendence is the only choice because you can adress the two millions of sounds in GM2 mode . Kontakt only 128 sounds .
   very important because now vA2 can play the four standards (ketron,yamaha,roland and korg ).

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #51 on: July 16, 2014, 09:20:07 AM »
Paulus,

I don't think you can run vArranger with audio synth + cubase, because most of audio soudn card can only work with only ONE program at a time.
So if you want to use an external audio software, you need to select a DirectSound Audio Out in vArranger MIDI PORTS.

Do you know that vArranger also own since recently a VST host for 32 bit plugins?

With this you can use the vArranger Synth + up to 16 VST instruments together.

You can for example select vArranger Synth for MIDI OUT 1  and VST for MIDI OUT 2

Then, there will be a new VST button on vArranger, when you can load up to 16 VST instruments.

Then, you can right click on every track, and select to send it to the vA synth, or any VSTi

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #52 on: July 16, 2014, 09:47:32 AM »
Thanks again for your information AGATON

I realise that i will have to learn so many things related to VST

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #53 on: July 16, 2014, 09:53:58 AM »
Hi Dan,

Just few hours ago while i was trying to set midi port with different configuration, suddenly vArranger crashed. Then it can't be run anymore, it always gave this "Err_Init : -1"

So, i deleted the vArranger config file, and replaced it with the original one (1 kb). vArranger is now working, but it can't detect my Sound Driver. The Midi Port Select window is only giving me : MIDI IN, MIDI OUT options. There is no Sound Driver option.

Could you please help me with this? Thank you

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #54 on: July 16, 2014, 09:58:32 AM »
Just install the vArrangerSynth plugin

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #55 on: July 16, 2014, 12:06:54 PM »
Thank you for your very quick response Dan.

I have installed the plugin, and now it gives me the AUDIO OUT option. Great!

Thanks.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 12:08:35 PM by paulus1971 »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #56 on: July 16, 2014, 12:23:24 PM »
What of ASudio Card have you paulus1971 ? Only internal Sound Card
from your Laptop or one external USB or FireWire Audo Card. It is very important.
Dan wrote about this problem that most of Sound Cards can work wit only one
program at a time. It is true, but good external Audio Cards are ASIO Multiclient
cards, and they can work with many applications at a time.
It is a same thing, either VST Host or vArranger2 VST by 32bit VST PlugIns
when you don't need Midi Routings and when one of VST PlugIns don't need
more than 2 GB of RAM (that is maximum of RAM for one 32Bit  application).

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #57 on: July 16, 2014, 05:53:23 PM »
vArranger VST host is I think limited to 4GB.
The advantage is that the routing is easy.
Simply, right click on any track and select the VST instrument that you want to use.
For VSTi that are not multi timbral, there is an option to send to channel 1 only
Later, I will add the possibility to use midi controllers, to change VSTi parameters
And also, save the VSTi full state per song/per sound
The other advantage is that it allows to use both the vArranger synth and 16 VSTi together and MP3 player/recorder
More to come....

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #58 on: July 16, 2014, 06:20:28 PM »
It will be amazing, vArranger2 as one complex Midi and VST host
Center, with all performances which are required for professional
use !!!
« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 06:24:05 PM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #59 on: July 16, 2014, 10:13:45 PM »
Hi Dan and Agaton,

Sorry to combine the message for both of you, just incase any of you miss my message.....

1. Dan, is it possible to do Drum Mapping in vArranger. Suppose i use "Addictive Drum" VST (the mapping is different from GM), is it possible to change 
   its mapping to conform to GM mapping?

2. Agaton, you mentioned about VST Host/Cantabile Performer. Can i change "Addictive Drum" mapping to conform with GM mapping using those
    software? i'm now using internal sound card only

Thank you

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #60 on: July 16, 2014, 10:30:36 PM »
Yes, in Cantabile Performer you can change Drum Mapping.
That is only one joke for Cantabile. Don't worry, Cantabile
can much more as simply Midi Note Mapping !!!

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #61 on: July 16, 2014, 10:34:23 PM »
Custom Midi mapping will come later for vArranger

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #62 on: July 16, 2014, 10:48:30 PM »
@paulus1971

Just one thing, what I forgot, XLN Addictive Drums Version 2 has GM Midi Note
Mapping !!! You can choice over 30 different Midi Note Mappings in Addictive 2. You
don't need Cantabile Mapping for Addictive 2, but you need Cantabile when you will
make Program Change with Drum Sets of Addictive Drums 2. In Cantabile you can
create Subsessions with different Drum Sets in Addictive Drums 2, and every of this
Drum Sets can has Program Change Number, also Bank Change Number. So vArranger
can send Midi Commands (Bank and PCG) to Addictive Drums 2 and change Drum Sets.
The best thing is, that is absolutely no delay by change of Drum Sets, just like in hardware
instruments.
Someone wrote about Yellow Tools Independence as software Sound Engine for vArranger2,
I have them and Independence sounded very good, but it is no right choice because of this
delay by Program Change on Style tracks. It is one very short crack to hear, and that is
unacceptable on live gigs. 

« Last Edit: July 16, 2014, 11:30:31 PM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #63 on: July 17, 2014, 12:18:56 AM »
Hi Dan and Agaton,

1. Dan, it will be really great if vArranger later on can do Drum Mapping
2. Agaton, thanks for your info about Cantabile and Addictive Drum 2 having GM drum kits

Gee, there are so many things i have to learn about vArranger and VST....so many things to learn...but i'm very Excited!

Thank you again for both of you  :)

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #64 on: July 17, 2014, 12:40:28 AM »
You're welcome. It is one very, very big field, specially when you will
make that on a professional level. I think when man one vArranger2
for his gigs use, than he is far from hardware toys, and wish to be
originally with his music and sound. So one software arranger like
vArranger2, is an open field to make your sound and performance
on the best and highest level, because you can decide what of high
quality VST sounds and what of thousand and thousand Styles you
will use. For this sense of value you have to sacrifice yourself for the
cause. It is not to much. Naturally, for the best sound and the best
performance only on software instruments (VST), you must have very,
very powerful Audio PC machine, but you can make your sound for now,
either with "light" software instruments like Hypersonic 2, or in "hybrid"
mode, with one hardware midi module like Ketron SD2 or SD1000 together
with some of sounds from NI Kontakt or Addictive Drums, or Emulator X3
 or... or... All bets are of.       
« Last Edit: July 17, 2014, 01:11:22 AM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #65 on: July 18, 2014, 11:49:02 PM »
Hi Agaton,

I've been trying to connect vArranger with Cantabile Lite and Yamaha MOXF. My questions are :
1. Can you change drum mapping with Cantabile Lite?
2. I am using behringer uca202 for my soundcard. Cantabile Lite can receive the audio input signal from MOXF, but no audio output signal. I don't know
    why. When I use this soundcard with Cubase, everything works properly
3. If you use vArranger with Cantabile and VST, and you assigned every style to different instruments in VSTs, that means every time you change style,
    you have to adjust the setting in Cantabile as well right?
4. Or everything can be done remotely from vArranger only?

Thank you for your help Agaton.

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #66 on: July 19, 2014, 12:34:29 AM »
1. I don't know about Cantabile Lite, but I think it funct !!!

2. Audio signal is no matter in your case, it is a Midi. You have to
install Yamaha USB Midi Driver, for first. Also, you must install
any virtual Midi driver. Than, you will make one Cantabile Project
with one "empty Rack" and choice for Midi In your Virtual Midi
driver (the same virtual midi driver must be Midi Out in vArranger),
and for Midi Out ("Send to" in Cantabile) Yamaha USB Midi from
MOXF. See picture in Attachment !!! Conclusion: Cantabile will be
in your case, one Midi Processing and Midi Routing Tool and has not
any audio function. You can deactivate audio In and Out on Cantabile,
you don't need that.



Don't forget to activate MOXF Midi Out Port in Cantabile Configuration
and also Virtual Midi In Port !!!
 




If Sound Program Map from Dan's Motif XS compatibel with MOXF is
than you don't need all of this, but you must instal Yamaha USB Midi
driver and than you will choice this driver in vArranger2 Midi Out field.



3. No, it is automatically, vArranger send Bank MSB and LSB and
PCG midi events from every Style track and every new Style on
Cantabile. In Cantabile you must have Multitimbral VST Instruments
with possibility to "understand" this events and change sound
programs (Hypersonic, Emulator X3, Kontakt, or your MOXF etc...)
on this order from vArranger2. But, you have to know that Styles in
vArranger2 are from music instruments (hardware arrangers) which
have different Sound Program Map as your MOXF. Cause of that you
must create one Sound Program Remap in Cantabile. Dan has made
Motif XS Program Map and you can try with this Instrument Map,
maybe it is very similar and you don't need to create Sound Program
Remapping in Cantabile. 
« Last Edit: July 19, 2014, 01:56:07 AM by agaton »

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #67 on: July 20, 2014, 12:08:08 AM »
Hi Agaton,

Thank you so much for your time and effort in helping me with the setup.

I really appreciate it!

I will try to learn what you have explained bit by bit, 'cause I've never done this thing before.

Again, thank you so much

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #68 on: July 20, 2014, 04:25:25 AM »
Hi Dan,

Could you tell me how to make  the same 10 sound  list i have set up to be availabe to all styles please?

Thank u

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Re: One Computer Installation Policy
« Reply #69 on: July 20, 2014, 11:37:10 PM »