vArranger Forums

Dear slaveof word

No I have not tested this setup in reality.

I did extensive stress testing of my computer system (trying to remove crackles and pops while playing an arrangement while playing vst's at the same time, since playing an arrangement on it's own is not the problem, it is the combining it with solo vst's that causes the pops and crackles especially if you want to be able to switch sounds fast). Unfortunately my computer is not good enough for such a system so I did not buy it. I am really not an expert, but my guess is that unless you have an extremely modern computer (with Benchmarkscores over the 8000), and optimised windows and a professional soundcard (which is more expensive than a hardware soundmodule) the result will tend to be dissapointing.

But ask mr. Agaton on his forum, you will most likely get a personalized answer.

In the meanwhile I wish you, Carlo and everybody else on the forum a Merry Christmas 

Hi Werner,

I can't wait to hear the result of the optimised V3 Sonority for v-Arranger 2  

Merry Christmass to you and to everybody on the forum 

Hi Carlo,

Google 'Transaudio Agaton'. You will see that Mr. Agaton has a dedicated forum. I do not know him personally, but I think he is a sound engineer (a very gifted one I believe) with many projects and ideas: one of his earlier ones was the TA soundengine that can be delivered by post on a small (size of creditcard) SSD drive with a special Windows version (optimised by Agaton to reduce latency without crackles) and the TA soundengine + vArranger: a few years ago he quoted me a price of 900 euro.

Please be informed that playing sounds exclusively on a computer in a live setting without crackles on high quality is a very difficult matter: simply owning a fast multicore Intel processor with much memory (I have 24 Gb) will just not do. I have spent many hours trying to optimize my computer, only with disappointing results (and I have followed the online solutions to optimise windows for audio: my Windows 7 starts up in about 20 seconds with normal hard drive – I am not sure if I want to invest into an SSD only to find out the crackles still have not gone). This makes me believe you realy do need to be a sound engineer or to contact one to design a computer setup that will work for you. I m not sure that just a TA soundengine on a SSD will produce the results you desire, maybe it will for you (contact mr. Agaton on his forum, usually he answers very fast) but don't count on it.

The latest creation to be of mr. Agaton is called TransAudio 'Avenger':  the quoted latency without crackles is far less than 1 ms. The demos in my opinion are supurb, in which creativity is stimulated: every sound can be choosen in a very intuitive way on the fly (like an organist would do). The  TA 'Avenger' not only containes the sounds and SSD but also several computers to process the sounds: these computers are tested to ensure that they can run three days non-stop in a row without crashing. No prices are released as of yet, but in the past mr. Agaton has only charged very little above the actual hard- and software costs for his product. In my opinion, if you do go for the complete computer option, it is wiser to go for the 'Avenger' to avoid  disappointments.  In the very least you will save yourselves weeks of aggravation in optimizing your audio computer. Also remember these are high end solutions (latest processors, fast memory, fast harddrives: SSD, T2, professional soundcard) that are much more expensive than a soundmodule + computer: of course for this price your mind will be blown away.

At this present time computer architecture is in the process of being completely re-written. With the appearance of Intel Optane memory it has become possible to have more than 1000 Gb internal memory instantly available at start up (since it is a non-volatile memory). In the future there will be no need to have a hard drive: everything you computer needs will be allready in the memory. Right now computers cannot handle all this information in one time since the whole way programs are written has to be changed for the processors to handle large information in one go. I recently spoke to a young mathematician who declared to me that the results in 10 years will be scary: since the mathematical models to facility this change have allready been developed and in the process of 10 years will be implemented in the various fields of information technology. He things human skills will not be necessary any more: personally I think this is far fetched, but I do think this means that in about 10 years it will probably be very easy to have an excellent sounding live sound engine driven by a computer system without the need of a brilliant sound engineer: will Native instruments or Spectrasonics win or will Yamaha Genos still prevail?

For now mr. Agaton has promised be to release the prices of his 'Avenger' very soon in 2018. I think right now he is very busy sound engineering for professionals.

Greetings,
Phil

Hello Werner,

Thanks for the info, and may you get well soon 

Bye the way, I have seen Deebach has finally released their Max (61 keys) and Maximus (88 keys) with following soundlist: http://www.deebach.eu/index_htm_files/Deebach-MAX%20Sound-Liste.pdf

Were you able to test this instrument in real-time? If so how does the Deebach Max(imus) compare to the V3 Sonority  Based on the given soundlist I think I would prefer the V3 Sonority since it at least containes a few stops of Classical organ and a nice selection of Theatre organ. The Max seems to be very strong on their Sax, the sax sounds of sonority on You Tube seemed a little weak to me. The great plus of the V3 Sonority would be the released INS-file and special adaptation for V-arranger.

Greetings,

Phil

Hi Werner, I like the concept: I would very much like to see at least 3-6x more samples of church organ, 3-6x more German organ and 3-6x more Hammond organ sounds, also the ability to add extra memory so that all the extra packs can be purchased together.

How is the testing going?

Greetings,
Phil

Thanks for the info , I have sent an e-mail for extra information.

@ Lylo

What do you exactly with 'buy a vArranger soundbank'?

The program Hauptwerk has a free Paramount 3 manual Theatre organ (https://www.hauptwerk.com/news/news/2010/04/27/paramount-310-free-theatre-organ-available/). I like the sound of it a lot    . Hauptwerk itself has a free version to that will load this theatre organ in stand-alone, but I do not know if the free version works as a vst (I have not been able to get the Hauptwerk-vst to work in other hosts and I do not own vArranger yet  to test it)

Thanks for trying mr Lylo

Thanks for your response mr Dan.  I guess I'll have to wait on the Trans Audio Custum sound engine...

Thanks mr. Lylo  and good Luck testing 

Here is some more info I found concerning the creating of multi's in Sampletank3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZTpfQN-Y6Q&list=PLePqEsD0HuSZf5wJz4kvqczLLlDf-GLIU&index=3

Thanks for the info mr. Lylo.

But this YouTube video ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifwWetspuPk  ) shows that Sampletank 3 can create a  'Live Set'  in which each Live set can contain up to 64 different 'songs'. Each song can contain up to 16 multi's. Program change numbers can be assigned to every song and every multi within every song. Also different Live Sets can be created.

Shouldn't it be possible to drive SampleTank3 with vArranger2 like this, since each instrument can be activated via a Program Change???

@Dan:   I just discovered Sampletank 3 (  for a free demo see http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/sampletank3/index.php?pp=sampletank-3-versions  ) : it can run as a Vsti with a 16 part selector, so 16 different instruments can be simultaniously selected for 16 MIDI channels).

Have you tested if the latest v-Arranger2 can run Sampletank 3 (64-bit), in which the styles (that are programmed to drive the 16 midi channels of Sampletank 3) play equally or better than for instance the Ketron SD2/SD1000?

Or is the only good option to wait for an excellent GM2 soundengine like that of TransAudio, in which the problem of this is that the very few demo's available sound excellent , but it is only guessing when the whole engine will be finished , as it is such a time-consuming work to program it. If styles played in vArranger 2 can drive the Sampletank 3 soundengine well, I may consider to use this software first and later upgrade to Agaton's more superior TransAudio soundengine later when it comes out  ...

@ Hawenue: Thank you for your evaluation: it is very encouraging to hear that mr. Agaton could deliver on his promise. I hope that mr. Agaton will also be able to sample some specific Wersi Spectra sounds: with  16 bit Wave Form Sampling , in which every voice is made of three subvoices, thus making it possible to construct your own sounds :: certainly warmer than the earlier 12bit organs, but these iron sounding organs (and it's drum machines) had a charm of their own if used with the appropriate choice of voice, and thanks to mr. Agaton a good old Wersimatic WM24 drummachine will be added to the TA custum soudnd engine . I also very much hope that mr Agaton will be able to get his hands on a good Wersi Helios however, and sample it's many variations, inclusive the airy sounds. I believe that Claus Wonderlich in terms of contemporate organ playing is kind of a 'golden standard' - for me at least: he really added soul and fun while playing the Wersi Helios.

@ Donny
@ Hawenue

I was expecting mr. Agaton to send me some examples of his samplings of the Wersi organs and on my request he even sampled a WersiMatic WM24. I was assuming I would get some mp3 audio examples to review. Instead I received some sf2 soundfonts. Since I do not own vArranger2 yet, and have no wish to dive myself in computer matters unless I have a fully working soundengine available that can play styles better than the Tyros 5, I have to depend on you two good people to evaluate it for me (check your private messages for the sf2 fount and please do NOT distribute it), maybe if you have time, even to private message me a mp3 recording if you have the means to do this. Could you tell me your opinion through private message please. I feel that mr. Agaton has the right to hear the first evaluations of his sweat before anybody else and if necessary to be given the opportunity to improve the sf2 soundfonts, before it is posted on a public post: good or not so good, at least he deserves this respect  for his great effort he is putting into this project.

Of course these samples only represent the vintage drummachine of Wersi, the samling of the Wersisounds is scheduled to come out end of july... I am happy that Agaton lives in Germany, the land of Wersi, with many working vintage Wersi organ (allthough mr. Agaton told me he will also be looking at the latest Wersi organ)

Agaton has sent me some sf2 files of the Wersimatic. This was my reply 'Thanks for your effort mr TransAudio!

Like I told you earlier I am not very computer smart, so I do not know how to use the sf2 files. Is there a way you can post this file at least to the 2 people on the vArranger2 forum that have agreed to evaluate the sampling (see Wersi thread). Thanks '

You have a nice setup. Does 5 presets mean that every know and slider can have 5 different functions assigned to them? How is the key-action of this board (fast or slow)?
I think you were also interested in the TransAudio Custum soundengine. In this case you can really give us hands on info, if this TA engine exceeds the soundgeneration of the T5.

@ Dan: a) I am very glad to hear you are going to implement HARMONY and ENSEMBLE later this year
            b) I am planning to buy the TA custum from Agaton (530 euro) that will come with the vArranger2 on the usb3 drive (880 euro's for the total package incl USB3drive, soundengine and vArranger) when it comes out and I will than ask that Agaton contacts you about these changes: I have all confidence you will handle these issues perfectly (as usual  )

@ Hawenue: no problem , I will contact you as soon as I get them. It seems you have the hardware to really make an informed opinion  that will lead to a valuable contribution.
     ps1. If you contact Agaton on his website 'Google transaudio forum) you can even ask him to make a price quote for the 'tailored' sound engine you want (and pay less). I personally wanted everything, but you can also choose a smaller one, if you allready own the sounds you like. I choose for the full option, since it also comes included with  lifelong updates and support. I feel compared to the Ketron SD1000, the TransAudio Custum is smaller much smaller, starts up faster (boots windows8 solid disk usb3 drive) and the sample sounds on facebook (of vArranger) sound very promising, as does als the HQclarinet TransAudio demo on You tube. I am hoping there will be less compatibility issues with this TAcustum than with the SD1000, especially after Agaton has communicated the desired changes.

 Some more info on the TA Sound Engine I found on the TransAudio forum today 'TA Sound Engine with all sounds is pretty big. It will be about 600 Sound Programs and many thousend samples. All sounds will be Multilayered and in stereo (cause of ambient and autentic resonator of instruments), with many Controllers implemented (SA and MV in Yamahas terminology, or RX in Korg terminology, or Super Natural in Roland terminology)' ---- The Tyros/ Korg and Roland MIDI files will therefore sound much richer than on  their hardware counterparts, but and I quote again' Dan have to play in the "same liga" because I need his help by Program Change and Midi Convert of some Midi events, and I hope he will make that'.

@ mr Dan: A)will you make the necessary changes as described above when Agaton brings out his TA sound Engine? My purchase of your VArranger2 software will depend on this implementation 
                 B) in what time frame are you going to implement the 'Essemble' function, with freely assignable functions: example: Essemble Voice (1) alt, (2) tenor1, (3) tenor2,(4) bass, whereby  you can freely assign any instrument to the Essemble voice 1,2,3, 4. Varranger2 will then divide the cords to each Essemble voice. You can imagine: professional styles combined with an Essemble voice function connected to a professional sounding library: this will sound grand 

OK Donny, I will contact you via this forum when I receive the demo sounds of Agaton 

@ Donny. Agaton is in the final stages of bringing out his TransAudio Custum module and has agreed to take a serious shot in sampling the German home organs. He has promised me to send me some sound demos for evaluation before the release end of july 2015. Would you be interested to receive a copy and let your evaluation be known, since I know you too a very passionate about the Wersi sound. Details of this TransAudio Custum module: GMbank of 17Gb, total sample content of 100 Gb,comes installed on Samsung 250 gb usb3 drive that has the size of a credit card (will boot with Windows8 that is specially tweaked for optimal Audio use all aspects of the tones can fully be altered, midirecorder and player and style converter included. Fully compatible with vArranger2, costs 530 euro without vArranger, if Dan is notified a vArranger2 can be unlocked on this usb3 drive).  Google transaudio forum for more info or ask Agaton.
So Donny, please let me know if you are interested to evaluate. I have an excellent ear, but am not a native Englush speaker and may not be able to convey in words precisely what changes I feel need to be made
Gr, Phil

  You are very right mr Agaton, I nearly forget about your earlier beautiful samples.

But what about the Wersi sounds, is your TA soundengine going to have it mr Agaton: I know at least 2 people who would love it: mr Donny (see his  Wersi post) and myself

in my opinion very authentic Wersi sounds for 785 euro/ 833 euro:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLt6lVPf6Ks
https://soundcloud.com/deebach/wersitime-mit-xms-pro
http://www.deebach.eu/audiodemos_xms.htm

The company sells a USB stick for the Korg , for those that do not own a Korg: there is a keyboard (called Max) for less than 50 euro more. Maybe you can convince Deebach to realse a SF2 Donny   

I love your TransAudio Hq Clarinet video on You Tube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vDxvh5Ve0c      But unfortunately I felt the rest of the accompanying style sounded 'fake' and dull to me: I hope this is not from the TA-soundengine?

But more important for me, what will your TransAudio Engine for vArranger 2 do for the European organ player, as the older Wersi organs have much more honeylike sweet high organ tones than the Hammond. The Deebach Max keyboard has some beautiful sampled  Wersi organs (Wersi Helios, Wersi Beta, Wersi spectra, Wersimatic drum:
              https://soundcloud.com/deebach/wersitime-mit-xms-pro
              https://soundcloud.com/deebach/deebach-xms-pro-f-r-korg-4
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLt6lVPf6Ks
                 01:20 Wersi
                 30:36 organ (and nice switching of the Rotary speed)+ guitar
                 53:40 quick seamless) soundchanges with on 56:03: seamless soundchanges on a typical organ arrangement
                 For the organplayer these seamless changes of sounds , rotary switching, different tonal organ sounds within the same organ model are vital.
                 Nice (in my opinion) in this video is also  7:26 dynamic e-piano playing, 09:37 Hammond (the building of), 15:50  church organ, 17:25 orchestra violins, 23:20 relaxation music, 24:40 different accordions: German, Dutch, Russian,  Argentian, French,  Italian, Austrian,26:22 mouth harmonica , 33:37 left hand drum=left speaker/ right hand drum = right speaker , 35:00 big band, 35:31 trumpet, 38:30 flutes, 40:10 orchestral flutes, 40:30 jazz flutes, 42:20 dynamic horns, 44:15 exotic flutes, 47:47 & 50:04 Max and vArranger,

              http://www.deebach.eu/videodemos_max.htm

The specs of vArrange2 are awesome, the TransAudio Engine for Clarinet speaks for it self (is this the same clarinet that will be on the TA engine for vArranger2) and shows promise for all blowers.  Unlike mr. Dan suggested, I do not want to mix up different soundengines together, as they will have different operation methods and is too confusing for me: no ease of use, I am therefor really hopîng the TA soundengine to be all inclusive. To be honest the organs (Wersi, Hammond and church) of the Deebach Max makes me melt away and since this is my main area of playing I hope you will not leave us wanting in this area mr. Agaton, so have you included Wersi organ and seamless soundchanges on your TransAudio Engine? 

How do the virtual hammond models compare to the real deal in your opinion Hawenue

Did you over try VB3 (GSI)? there is a free Demo and a nice Youtube video. After Dan pointed me out to this Hammond model I ditched the NI B4 II VST Plugin, because I liked  the VB3 much better (of course it is only my opinion)... By the way Haweneu I listened a few times to the link ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLt6lVPf6Ks ) you recommended me and I love it  (and thank you tremendously for referring me to this Max keyboard of Deebach) .

  CONGRATS  in advance mr Agaton for your finishing your TA soundengine.

I was allready wondering why the LD DAVE 8 Roady was nearly 100euro more expensive, but now I know I should go for the LD Dave 8 XS

I was allready looking for (cheap temporary) hardware solutions, just in case it would take much longer, I stumbled on the Fame G2000 (a.k.a Medeli (=the maker of the Wersi Pegasus Wing) A1000) which now is 299euro at the musicstore.de: 7 inch colourtouchscreen display, a few not so bad sounds; including church organ (I do think the Ketron SD1000 sounds much better), with a five octave keyboard that is 12 times cheaper than the Ketron Keyboard. I have never heard this board personally though and my positive impressions are only based on YouTube postings:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efQR7Ihl8sQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LMZa_Kd4zI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQLSRa--c4A

But I guess I will first wait until july: the role out of the vArranger2 with the superior TA soundengine. Will you (mr. Agaton) or mr. Dan posting some betatesting sounds on YouTube or will I need to take a (very little) step in the dark when I purchase version 1.18 and purchase the the TA sound-engine (while counting on the very nice sounding mp3 samples posted on Facebook?  Unfortanately I will not be posting videos straight away; since I am postponing the purchase of the RME Babyface to see if I am as smart as mr. Agaton thinks I am (in being able to master operation of the vArranger 2 in half an hour -- I don't mind a learning curve of a few days though) and of course the satisfaction with the TA soundengine (I have very little doubt in that matter though): of course I would not want to disgrace this superior TA soundengine with posting sounds recorderded with my standard pc soundcard...

In that case I guess it will be the LB systems Dave 8  . How is the modulation matrix programming progressing:  of the 5000+ how many to go ( or is it a secret  )

I see you are not selling you Band-in-a-Box. Is this the reason you are selling V-arranger2? Do you use the live cord progression (in real time) in B-i-a-B to tel the live styles in which cords they should play, or do you pre-program the cords in B-i-a-B?

I think I am going to take your advice mr Agaton and at least get the RME Babyface. Since I allready have reasonable passie speakers I may get the LD systems 15, which will give me enough time to save for the Bose 2xL1 typeII with tonematch, since I like lustening to classical music too

Thanks mr Agaton, mr Dan, mr Terry and mr Lylo for your honest and valuabel contributions.

The fact is that I need to put a second sound card in my 24 Gb ram pc (4 core Xeon 2.0GHz since my family has 'seased' this pc as it is hooked on to my 48" LED tv. Currently if I put on my headphones I am forced to listen to whatever the soundcard is playing as I cannot seperate the channels. Of course I can wait until everybody is sleeping (as I do now), but I need my sleep to .

So before I'll invest into the RME + 2xbose L1model1 compact with tonematch, it seems very wise to first try out the Hifimediy Sabre U2 with USB isolator +LD Dave 10 since the last setup will cost me less than 600 €. If I am still found wanting I can still decide if I want to upgrade to a system that costs 5x more. Of course I still hope to be able to test the LD Dave 10 before I buy it, as I am right now am using an JVC amplifier with passiveTecnics speakers of about 15+ years old, which had the same relative price in the time: but I think that the current active systems outclass the passive systems of those days...

Thanks for you info mr Dan and mr Agaton. I can than safely buy the RME babyface and save 700€. The Bose L1 model II with  tonematch is 2900€. But my first dream come true is the TA sound engine

I hear your mr Dan and I thank you for your contribution, as I do agree with you that cheaper solutions always should be tried out first. Their is no doubt that a cheap car will more than adequately will you to your destination, you do not have to drive a Rolls Royce. Yet I do believe that a Rolls Royce has its benifits for those who can afford it. I guess we will have to wait on Agaton if the 'Golden standard setup' (=RME soundcard+.) will be an added value for vArranger2 in combination with the TA sound engine. As I do not own a Ketron SD1000 I do not know if this module will sound any better with high quality equipment (the audio jacks of this module certainly do not look top high end, but looks may decieve), listening to your demo on You Tube through my stock soundcard and cheap headphone definately give me much fun: should the TA sound engine never comes to birth I will gladly will by the Ketron SD1000 with vArranger2 - of course I am still hoping and counting on the development of the TA sound engine by mr Agaton, but I believe the modulation matrixing is taking a lot of time and I am therefor still waiting patiently. I think it is precisely this increase in sound quality that could make this TA sound engine worthy of upgrading with an excellent sound card and excellent speakers, while less superior sounds in a module would not benefit from these enhancements. Of course I have never heard the TA sound engine and I am certainly not a sound expert. But I like what I am hearing on the facebook demos of the TA sound engine. I believe mr. Agaton is the person to answer the question if these high end hifi solutions have any benefit for the musician. Weather this benefit is actually worth the extra money, I believe is a question to be answered by the person who is buying it.

The inputs for me seem unnecessary. It is the outputs I am eying (not for the Hammond organ as the traditional Hammond speaker in my opinion was absolutely not hifi). The haupwork people do offer multichannel outputs if the audio card can handle it. Do you think that a normal setup can adequatly produce the sound of a 32" bass and a 1" flute tone of a church organ?

ps3 thanks mr Dan for your more than valid contribution, since I now play my hauptwerk on a stock sound card and 30€ headphones and it does give me much joy (allthough no tears in my eyes or relaxation of my muscles). It is very important to know the best options in every price category.

It was for the same reason I am very interested in your program: the organs that I dream of costs between 30.000€ and 70.000€ and therefore unattainable for me (allthough I very recently learned of the new and much cheaper Wersi Pegasus Wing Duo). Your program forms a valid alternative that can be upgraded as the budget allows it. I therefore would be curious to hear from mr Agaton or any other sound wizard how  good this Hifimediy Sabre U2 Asynchronous DAC really is (together with my other questions of course)

ps2 mr Dan:the  Hifimediy Sabre U2 Asynchronous DAC seems like a cheap first start before investing 1200€ in the RME Fireface UCX. Of course I need to look to mr Agaton to ask if that card is any better than a standard sound card and could be used as a preliminary step before investing 20x more in the RME and superior output media. I do know I once listened to a headphone of 300€ and a soundcard of the same price while playing on a hauptwerk organ: there was no doubt in my mind that it was a much better set than my own (and actually brought tears of joy into my eyes). The wife of that man confessed to my wife that she though he was crazy (in his obsession of organs and good sound), and I think my wife thinks the same of me. Since I only play music for my own enjoyment a more than superior sound quality means very much to me and is worth the extra money (if I have it), maybe it is a way to compensate for my more than inferior musical abilities . , just as I love to listen to those musicians that do have the gift to play beautifully: the joy they can bring to me is in my opinion fully worth the money that has to be payed to listen to them. So if you are willing and ablemr. Agaton please let us know your opinion in what is the best speaker setup for me and what would be an excellent headphone

ps mr Agaton: please disregard my last question on the RME Fireface UCX as you have allready stated that it contains the very best of Mic Preamps . All my earlier questions remain.

Yes indeed mr. Agaton .

The reason I would like to know is that I like to play the churchorgan through Hauptwerk playing pipes ranging from 1" to 32": They advice playing different sets of pipes through different sets of channels and speakers. I think I read somewhere that most living rooms do not have the physical dimensions to play a 32" pipe adequate (I do not the status on my living room: the longest part of my living room is 14m, the widest part is 6m, L-shaped, highest part 3,20m  and lowest 2,70m). If the 'golden standard' speaker set (on different) channels is feasable I may consider to skip the Bose L1 compact (which recieves very good reviews  accept maybe for the low tones and a little cluttered midtone range that can be offset by an equalizer) and buy the 'golden standard' speaker system bit by bit and just choose a superior headphoneset for the time being  (which make and model, and can I use the headphone jacks in the RME Fireface UCX adequate or do I use a different system for the headphone all together) since I mostly will play with headphones anyway. I am curious which kind you advice as I know you can buy a nice car for the price of some very expensive (for me at least  )speakers...

Just to satisfy my curiousity Agaton; what kind (Make and Model) of Active Speakers would you recommend if money was not an issue: bearing in mind that the very low tones of the church organs will probably use a different channel than the higher tones: like this I know if I can upgrade (and use a good pair of headphones while waiting (which headphones do you recommend?) or best keep dreaming of winning the lottery

How about the RME Fireface UC: USB connection, 8 analog outputs (so i can direct the low tones/ instruments to different speakers than the high ones. Since I have bad experiences with second hand (they allways brake on me) I though it better to opt for a RME with less outputs than a Presonus, since I am deducting from your statements that the RME is better quality.

So what setup,make and model of speakers will do justice to the RME soundcard mr Agaton, mr Terry and other sound experts? I suppose the active speakers are the better choice nowadays? I do not need a high output speakers(since it is only for home use (lroom = L-shaped room of about 70 square meters in size with a height of 2,70 m) and I don' t really like loud music. . My suggested budget = 4x500 euro

ps Agaton: I guess around 200 euro for a sound card feels enough for me...

p.s. Thanks Terry, for your kind advice!!!

I totally agree, the vB3 in my opinion sounds superior to the one of Native instruments (see You tube). If you right click on the drawbars (in the vB3) you get a MIDI-learn function (in case you are like me, in which the wrong and frustrating way to do things comes easier than the so called intuitive way  ) Good luck, and excuse my French

After reading up to get some basic knowledge of Modulation Matrices (while other of us have actually cracked their heads in modulating sounds all day ) I am happy to get some advice of those who have hands-on experience in sounds and soundsdesign. I have dusted of my Bohm and once again hooked up to my computer to be once again utterly frustrated  by the nagging installation processes to get everything to work. It is precisely for this reason I was charmed by the V-arranger2 & Ketron SD1000 and of the upcomming TA Sound-engine: ease of use!!!. And boy, the learning curve to get the vB3 setup, was so frustrating (only in the end did I realise that with a right click a midi-learn function was available, that I nearly decided to sell everything and just buy a Wersi Pegasus WIng with second keyboard and bass. But I am just holding on to try out the V-arranger with TA Sound-engine and if I cannot learn this quickly with a big touch-screen attached to it, then  . What are your thoughts Agaton of the Native Instruments Audio 6: this sound card should have Multiclient Audio Drivers and has Cirrus Logic converters, and Mr Agaton - as you know allready  I do not know what that means in the real world , but the people in the reviews hail this cheaper soundcard and claim it is far superior than its price suggests. As you know by now: I don't believe everything I read  . And Mr. Agaton what sound design information do you have  of the Wersi Pegasus Wing (2 manual + vass) should the vArranger2 with TA Sound Engine not be easy enough for me to (learn to) operate?

I can see by the late hours Agaton that you really are trying, so please let me not rush/ hurry you . I must be patient and not doubtfull . Much succes with your modulation matrix . You mention that Yamaha has superior DA convertors. I suppose that a soundcard has DA convertors too, if so Agaton can you recommend a soundcard with excellent DA convertors, preferrable USB connected and this (you know me by now) at acceptable price?

I do hope this is an 'open goal'  and was seriously hoping on the availability of the TA Sound Engine. The sounds are reported to be superior to the Ketron SD1000. Allthough VST can offer oven more superior sound, in my opinion the searching for the right sound amidst the great availabilities, the high cost price (for each engine you often have to pay) completely takes away my fun in browsing through sounds and playing a melody that pops in my head as I hear the sound. So allthough I my allways play my Hauptwork churchorgan VST and must confess that the VB3 (that Dan recommended me) sounds much better than the one of Native instruments and takes away my desire to play on a keyB organ, I am really in search of good Sound Engine, so Agaton: I hope you have not given up and still have the strength to continue development of your TA Sound Engine If not please state , since I am postponing my purchase of a SD1000 and varranger2 (since I do not have a complete sound library to play the styles) just because I am waiting on your work. I am even, in time willing to pay for additional soundpacks - since browsing through useful sounds is a pure joy for me. I also see that organ makers like Lowrey and Wersi boast with their preset: Lowrey giving 10 organ presets for every 10 acoustic presets and they boast in having over 4000 presets combinations. I think the imput of a soundengineer in generating alternate presets in vArranger would really be helpful since I for one can appreciate the beauty of sounds but am unable to create of shape them. So I can hear a pop song, know there is a piano in it, but am unable to shape the available piano sound to sound exactly like the one in that pop song. In the 2015 Korg Kronos they have there named the presets exactly like the name of the corresponding pop song and have made sure the sounds sound exactly alike. So Agaton: is you TA sound engine still coming, and how do you see my last statement concerning the (song)presets???

Thanks for your swift reply Dan. When I try to run Hauptwork standalone together with another standaloneVST, hauptwork does not allow the other standalonevst to access asio-drive soundcard (or vice versa), I suppose this is not the case when the hauptwork vst is loaded into vArranger2? In anycase I am looking very much forward to the addition of the TA sound engine. If there are no latency issues with the Asio sounddrivers (and I expect none, since my very heavy Hauptwork organ has no latency issues, dispite the stock sound card installed), then you'll see me ordering for the vArranger. The fact the harmony/ ensemble function will be added will only add icing on the cake...

 
Woh Agaton!!!
Thanks in advance, as I believe than - in reading all the earlier comments - all the (30 year) of expertise/ time/ sweat is not reflected in the fee. So thank you again for this great favor!

p.s. 1 will aftertouch be available in the scripting/ layering (sorry, I do not know the appropriate terminology for it) of the samples as I am concidering of using a XKey 37 of CME in conjunction with my Bohm Musica Digital 1030 XL, hopefully being able to mirror Hector Oliveira's performance of the latest Roland Atelier with strings on You Tube.

p.s. 2 How will the Hammond modelling be, simple like the Ketron or more detailled like the KeyB (this last sound makes me tingle)

p.s. 3 Will church organ be properly represented? Since today I am forced to use Hauptwork, which is very good, but a bundled sound engine with proper church organ sounds will be much easier to use

p.s. 4 Will the ensemble function (like in the Tyros 5) be used in your TA Sound Engine in which when playing a cord the lowest notes are played by the bass instrument, the highest notes by the soprano instrument and the middle notes by the (a guess ) tenor instrument


The 4 ps's are by no means a deciding factor for me, as for me the reference was the Ketron SD1000 module, but with such high aspirations of exceeding the hardware arrangers you have made me wonder. Since I am by no means a sound engineer I do however have no idea on how much work the above p.s.'s would take to be fullfilled, so please do not be distracted by them and what ever your point of view on these 4 matters I wish you much success in finishing up your very ambitious project , that I know will make many people (me included) very, very happy

Keep on the great work Agaton!

I was planning to buy the Ketron SD1000 with the V-arranger2, but since it I will mainly use for home-use, I guess I could wait for the TA sound engine from you TA System Instruments to be made available in version 1.8 . But for me to make this decision, I would like to know if your sound engine would significantly drive up the price  of version 1.8, because if so I would rather first invest in de Ketron SD1000 and only upgrade to your superior TA sound engine if I was not to satisfied with the Ketron SD1000 (which to me sound more than adequate presently). If your complete TA sound engine however would be simply included in version 1.8 at no (or little) addional cost compared to the current version, it would not make economically sense for me to invest in a Ketron SD1000 as the sounds in your TA sound engine are superior to the Ketron SD1000. In this case I would just have to join the line of hopeful fans waiting on V-arranger2 version 1.8 with the TA sound engine included.

Are your willing/ are you at liberty to share any thoughts about this Agaton?