Style Creator

[one]

Is there any way to edit or create a new style like on the
technics keyboard.

[jan1kow]

I do not think (99.9%) that Varranger is a style editor it can personalise your style volume, reverb , fx and instrument settings etc. but not change the way a style plays.
Dan will off course confirm this for sure as I am only a user.
jon

[one]

thanks jan1kow but what I was trying to say is there any way to edit the
styles with another keyboard then bring its back to varranger.

[jan1kow]

vArranger normally plays any of the following formats - ketron and yamaha (soon to come roland)
sst
pat
bcs
prs
PAT
sty
ssr
any editing of the styles on original keyboards usually work also in vArranger

jon

[Dan]

I will add a style creator in a next vArranger free release.

Before that, you can edit styles on Yamaha or Ketron keyboard, or, try renaming a Yamaha style to .MID and edit it with any midi sequencer, like cubase.

I can help you understanding what inside the styles...

[rikkisbears]

Hi Dan,
great that you're going to add a style creator , for the Ketron Styles??

Changing .sty extension to .mid won't work with Yamaha styles , you'll lose the casm settings  ( as far as I'm aware). I do it to create my korg styles, but the casm settings are then added in the keyboard itself.

There's a couple of links below, may be of help.

I haven't used the program in a long time , but the second link MB's Stylemaker along with a pc sequencer that supports markers, may be useful.


http://www.jososoft.dk/yamaha/
http://psrtutorial.com/MB/stylemaker.html

[Dan]

I think my style creator, will come with a new vArranger style format, to be able to use a mix of features from all style formats

[Bernie9]

It just keeps on getting better.

[one]

This is gonna better then any arranger keyboard out there with this feature. The song chord already makes this software amazing. Thank you Dan...keep it
coming.

[rikkisbears]

Hi Dan,
what, you're thinking of a totally NEW format? That's interestesting.
So I gather you'd create the style from  a . mid file, like I can do for my korg??.

Still be great to have a ketron Editor at some stage, only thing my sd1 lacked, some sort of event list editor.

Please keep us informed about your progress, sounds really interesting.

I think my style creator, will come with a new vArranger style format, to be able to use a mix of features from all style formats

[jolon28]

vArranger normally plays any of the following formats - ketron and yamaha (soon to come roland)
sst
pat
bcs
prs
PAT
sty
ssr
any editing of the styles on original keyboards usually work also in vArranger

jon

Bonjour,

Il serait bon de lister dans le manuel de vArranger la liste des différents formats de style reconnus par vArranger. sinon il faut parcourir tous les posts du forum pour avoir l'info.
Je continue ma découverte du logiciel, j'avoue que le son obtenu avec un module SD2 est stupéfiant.

[anazariz]

Dan, is this feature still on your to-do list?

[BjayG]

Hi,

There was no response to anazariz's question - so what was is the answer...

Its now 3.5 years since it was first suggested by Dan as being in the next release ( February 25, 2012)  - so is it ever going to happen or is this yet more vA vaporware?

Barry

[silviuturcu]

Unfortunately..

[Dan]

Yes, this is still on my to do list. On the first place ! But then I just look to the second item of the list
For sure I will do it....

[BjayG]

Hi Dan,

It would actually be quite helpful for a lot of people if you actually made your TODO  list public.  As well as giving people a chance to provide feedback on their priorities it might also help to reduce some of the frustrations about apparent lack of or progress  (and I do stress apparent - because I'm sure like a duck although little seems to be happening on the surface - you are busily paddling away underneath).

Barry

[Juraj Letko]

Hi All,
I just add my vote for style creator / editor as great feature to have. The piano roll style notes editing would be nice to have there as well.
Juro

[Lylo]

Hello, Dan is not Superman, just a man, he work very hard for vArranger and must have always a priority, make vArranger with no crash, this priority need more and more time for all new function.
The time of one demand = one feature in a minute is dead, we will be patient if we must vArranger always on the good way. 

[Pasque]

Hello, Dan is not Superman, just a man, he work very hard for vArranger and must have always a priority, make vArranger with no crash, this priority need more and more time for all new function.
The time of one demand = one feature in a minute is dead, we will be patient if we must vArranger always on the good way. 

Hello,
+1 
Since beginning of vA, Dan has always listened customers/users needs.
He works hard for us and our pleasure.
We get new versions without extra costs, I think he is waiting some understanding and patience from us
Pasque

[BjayG]

Lylo - you seem to jump to Dan's defence so quickly when you think he is being got at - that I'm beginning to suspect that you are his mother 

So let me be absolutely clear - at no time do I doubt that Dan is committed to vA and I certainly have no doubt at all about his excellent technical abilities.    In addition I also think that vA is a good arranger - although in all honesty I don't yet feel that it is a great arranger  (but could be).  This is because it has some annoying inconsistencies and some vital missing facilities such as performance memory;  random things not being stored; and lacks a decent way of auditioning styles.   By the latter I mean that being able to use Roland, Korg, Ketron and Yamaha styles is great - but if that gives access to (I dunno) 100000 styles but you cannot easily find the one you want then this is an issue.  In addition I think that Dan's support is excellent when you have a problem BUT ....

My personal gripe is actually very simple and is not that controversial:-

1) I feel that my (and I know other peoples) views are being ignored.  Dan has never answered the thread I raised about 'Save mode does not save all it should ' (and which others agreed)  neither in the forum nor privately.  And it appears that he was doing his best to ignore this one too (there are other examples).     It should be noted that at least 2 people who participated in that thread appear to have sold their vA licence  (and one actually told me it was because he was fed up).   So that should tell you something...     I have no idea why there is no response and there may be a perfectly good explanation - but frankly I just find it rude.

2)  I have had vA for 2.5 years and I cannot detect any form of a plan as to where this program is going.   Controversial I know - but I cannot see the point of wasting effort on adding comprehensive VST support when there are perfectly good hosts already available and there are lots of basic arranger facilities still missing.   I fully understand that Dan has got very limited resources (particularly if he is only programming when he has spare time - and with a family, and doing gigs - I would be amazed if he has any time).     Then all the more reason why that valuable time has to be focused on the important things.     I (and I'm sure many others), consequently,  do not think it unreasonable that there should be a published 'wish list' and whether they will implemented (and any likely timescales).   Why would that be controversial - its simple to implement and we could at least see where we are going and gives people the chance to add to it.    NOTE FOLKS: PLEASE DO NOT WASTE TIME ON ARGUING THE VST CASE AGAIN - ITS DEAD!

I really am not the enemy here and I do not want to just generate endless arguments or walk away from vA - I just want to know we are going somewhere (and that not unreasonable).   

And contrary to what was written in the above mentioned "save mode does not save all it should"  thread in which it was stated that: "you do not know what you are frigging talking about"  - well I actually do.  I have used synths, pianos, organs, keyboards, VST instruments  for 30 years.  I was in professional IT for 35 years - of which nearly 20 years was as a technical computer programmer plus 10 years as a software development manager.   In addition I have written (and write) music related software and some of it was sold world wide. 

So - please - just better communication...

Cheers
Barry

[Lylo]

Yes, I'm not the mother of Dan and you know why ? It's because I'm a man. 

I think you don't understand the revolution for vArranger to jump at the audio function.
At the begining vArranger worked only whit the SD2, that's really good in 2010 but in 2015 it's the past. Perhaps for you vst is nothing but me I see the new univers open and I must be patient because  we are not on the same land that before.
I'm tired (it's the night here) and my english is to bad for explained all is in my mind  but I just say I use vArranger for all gigs (100/years) since 2010 and I never see the limitation has a problem.
Today I worked on a tracks list of 100 titles and thursday I shall make a balroom with it, and actualy I use only the v1.17 on stage.

So I'm not the mother of Dan but Dan is a father for me. 

[anazariz]

Dan, I need to create some Ketron styles to use on my SD1000 (using Varranger). What would be the best way to do that? I have StyleMagic YA. But that only works with Yamaha. I have Cubase so I can easily create the styles if I have the correct setup. Do you have any documentation on the structure of a Ketron Style? I looked around on the site and didn't find anything. There is a software called Style Works XT. But I only need to create a small number of styles (5-6) and for that purpose, that software is way too expensive. That's basically why I asked a while back if Varranger was going to have a simple style creator, which would make the task of occasional style making much easier for me. For now, Cubase would do if I know the structure of a Ketron style. By the way, as an IT Manager I totally understand the time and effort needed to create and sustain a quality software such as the Varranger. Thank you for all your hard work and happy holidays.     

[Dan]

Thank you.
You really don't need to create a Ketron style to play with the SD1000
There is no problem to create a Yamaha style with StyleMagic YA, and play it with vArranger and the SD1000.

[anazariz]

Thanks for your quick reply Dan.

I tried that. The YAMAHA styles sound wrong when played on the SD1000 (especially if you're not in the GM mode). StyleMagic YA inserts header SYSEX and other setup messages (File Format, program# and EFX per each accompaniment channel, GM/XG state, etc.), which are correct for a YAMAHA (XG) keyboard but have different counterparts on the Ketron side. In facts, that's the only reason (header information) I use StyleMagic YA. I create the sections in Cubase and use StyleMagic YA to add the header information. The styles sound as intended on my YAMAHA keyboard but sound terrible on the SD1000. Can I reassign the sounds in VArranger (per channel) and save them locally (in other words overwrite the header information via VArranger)?
Thanks.

[Dan]

You need to use vArranger in SD1000 mode
There is no reason they will sound bad.
vArranger does not send the Yamaha sysex to the SD1000
You can post a style, so I will try it
You can also reassign sounds in vArranger and SAVE SONG

[anazariz]

Will do! Thanks.

[Gashi]

Comment tu va créé le stylo pour varranger quel logiciel cou utiliser?

[anazariz]

Dan,

It would be really nice if one could create a quick style in VA without having to jump thru hoops in various pieces of external software. I believe you may already have some of the basic components needed to put such feature together. I know that this was one of your to-do items in 2012 (as shown in this thread) and that was one of the main reasons I chose VA over BK-7M (that does offer style creation) several years back.

Being a professional IT person, I have always wondered how the "pay one time and get lifetime updates" business model is sustainable because it eliminates the incentive for the developer to deliver major updates. Major update in this case would be things like style creator, 64-bit, looper, sampler, audio pitch shifter, etc. However, when it comes to VA, I don't expect the features I mentioned because there are a lot of companies out there that specialize in such products. However, style creation is a different matter. VA as a sophisticated auto-accompaniment software lacks the most elementary feature offered by most arranger keyboards over the price of $400. I know that some of your customers may not like the suggestion I am about to make because they also purchased the software under the assumption of "free updates for life". However, I am willing to pay a reasonable fee for your efforts because I understand that there's effort involved. Also, I don't mind if you market it as a separate product, similar to your soundfonts, so long as the price is reasonable for an add-on feature. I think if it's priced too high it'd put the combined price of VA and Style Creator on par with BK-7M. However, BK-7M comes with its own hardware. In VA's case that would equate to VA + Style Creator + Computer + Audio Interface (or a midi sound module such as the SD1000).         

While I am thankful for the features you've added to VA, like VST, I still view VA as a sophisticated auto-accompaniment and not a VST host or a DAW. However, having to do a lot of extra work just to create a simple on-the-go midi-based style, has deterred me from using VA to its potential.

Thanks

[Pekilik]

I have an idea,

We know that any update for vA2 is free and this is nice for as, but it is not for Dan especially if he have not new buyers,
he have not motivation to do new stuff in vA2 and he must start some new job or some new app which can bring him more money
because vA2 does not make more mony...

My idea is that we make one Topic on forum where we can write our wishes and Dan can write price for that if you can add this in vA2  in a reasonable time,

or we can make a survey and we can vote for wishes which we are put in the survey, but Dan must to tell as does is it possible to do this,
because sometimes it is not possible to put somethings in the app, but however Dan can put price for wishes which can add in app
and we can donate some many for that wishes and he can put report on right side where is wish and we can see how much money has been collected and when money reaches the price it has written he can start work on this that add this wish in the app...

I think that it is fair for Dan and for as....

[bluebeat]

Pekilik, I think you are 100% correct. I wrote almost same thing couple of days ago. It would be nice to have a style creator that Dan talked about 5 years ago in this topic and some other things that people desire. If people paid for vArranger, I am sure many will pay for major update, such as style creator for example.

Dan, not sure why you do not want to try this. Make a private poll and see what your customers are ready to pay. It is a bit fustrating o see people asking for certain logical items, but Dan does not reply. It would be a shame to see vArranger get outdated... like many software titles in similar categories. The problem I see, that people who developed similar products were of age. They have made something woking and that was it. But Dan, you are one of the youngest of them., you know that to keep pouct alive, you have to develop it. Not sure what seems to be the problem, if people are offering you to pay for it willingly. Would love to hear back.

[Igor Electronician]

Hi,

Dan always stressed that high cost vA2 due to  long planning and support advanced functionality, including  "Style editor". Now someone is trying to promote idea that it requires certain financial investments. Although Dan on this topic are not leading the conversations... There are still a number of issues with current and  main functionality of the program that are not resolved at this time in full.

[anazariz]

I understand your point Igor and as seen in my last post I was anticipating that some folk would not like my proposition. I also understand your point about fixes taking precedence over new features. However, in light of you and I getting neither (major fixes nor updates), it is logical to conclude that the model is not working. So we can continue on the perpetual path of being unhappy about getting neither or think of a model that would benefit us all (including you, me and Dan). Obviously the current model needs rethinking.

[anazariz]

Besides, with most businesses the seller works hard on retaining existing customers because of the financial incentives involved (the money you pay for upgrades). What's the financial incentive here, after the initial purchase?

[bluebeat]

Игорь, you get what you pay for. I think it is nice that Dan is maintaining the program, but to have a muscle feature such as creating a new style from ANY given styles, I would not mind to pay for! And I am certain that some of us would not mind to pay as well, to bring such feature to life.

I know there are some programs out there that can do that, but they are in LIMBO. Nobody updated them for many years. Not intuitive, buggy stuff. It is like ghost from 1990s.

Are you here for the music? Look at big picture! The only way to trully make VA more creative is to make style creator.
Modular is the way to go. For example, Igor Electronician does not want to buy it, because he do not need it, and he do not have to.  Dan is offering  his soundbanks....I believe at about 100e or so. I do not need them, but I think price is fair, if they are good. Do they have imperfecions? I am sure they do! But if I needed, I would buy it. 

In any case, would love to hear from Dan, if style creator is possible or not. There have been talks on this forum for a few years now... Dan you are reading this. Don't be shy. Can you answer please?

Thank you.

[Igor Electronician]

Good day to all!

I would not be against investment and encouraging the developer, though not using vArranger2 for commercial purposes. But  activity Dan's is much decreased, it often does not respond and ignores issues of users. Don't know what it is connected, but does not inspire confidence and optimism... Of Course, that this model of interaction between the developer and the consumer of software product is ineffective. By the way, sound banks, which is discussed, also I was not able to assess their sound, although I would send Dan MIDI files for this. To me it is nothing sent. And buy, as we say: "a pig in a poke" something not desirable. )) The problem with synchro-start of styles associated with system of chord recognition, rules transposition of parties auto-accompaniment, in styles that use guitar and voice banks - all remained unresolved. But do not lose hope, believe in the best.

[nikola]

But do not lose hope, believe in the best.

I Agree with you Igor 100%.

[bluebeat]

Ok, a long one, for the ones in opposition.
Igor, Nikola. Your points are valid, but I do not feel you understand
bigger picture. It happens. Do not worry   Bugs should be fixed in
Varranger . I agree 100%. Absolutely!

What this topic is about..., that most likely Dan has an idea for STYLE CREATOR and most likely some programming was done already. If
it is a paid labor, it will give him initiative to work on it... Unless he won the lottery or became a drunkard, which I doubt. There is NO good software that I  know of that will allow to do style mixing/creating, ALL of the stuff out there is outdated rubbish. I rather have something that works 95% than do not have something, that I know I will ENJOY.  What bothers me is that Dan is keeping his lips tight. Any kind of solid answer would be appreciated.
For example:
1) I am working on it, Beta should be ready in a several month
2) I am working on it, it will be 100000 Euro when it is done as a separate purchase
3) I want to make it, but not sure how much / how many people want to contribute
4)I want to do it, but I have 10 children to take care of and will not happen for few years
5)I do not have plans to release such feature in near or distant future

Why it is important to me? Because I gave up most of my hardware and switched mainly to software for making music. This feature is very
important to me. If this feature is not coming... I should look into other options by purchasing/learning other software. But Dan is making
one, I will surely wait and when it is ready, I do not mind to pay for it.

Dan anything you want to say or add?

[Pekilik]

Haha you guys have huge faith, it's very nice....

[nikola]

Bluebeat I think that the Answer is:
5),,I do not have plans to release such feature in near or distant future"

Dan are you reading?

[anazariz]

Looks like Dan welcomed a new member yesterday. He may want to chime in and shine some light on the future direction of VA2 as a product.

As I mentioned in my prior posts, I initially invested quite a bit of money in VA2 + StyleMagicYA + SD1000 + some other related hardware and software despite the fact that VA2 lacked the Style Creator feature because I saw Dan's post about how he was going to add that feature. While I was waiting, I played around with some temporary alternatives. 

A couple of those temporary alternatives:
1) Currently you can switch between 20 arrangements in Cubase using an external device. This is equivalent to changing style sections in VA2. The problem is the chord recognition piece since arrangement parts in Cubase are static. There are several ways to get around that. One way is to use a VST plugin called Nora. However, since I use Kontakt a lot, I decided to create a Kontakt script that does chord recognition for me.             

2) Reaper is a fully matured, stable $60 DAW that incorporates scripting. In my case, it would not be hard to convert my Kontakt chord recognition script to LUA, which is one of the three scripting platforms in Reaper.

So my objective when I resurrected this thread was not to stir up a heated discussion. I only wanted to find out if VA2 has reached the end of its development lifecycle since the software has been relatively stagnant for some time now. I'll be totally OK if it has. I just won't hold my breath for that feature to get implemented  

[bluebeat]

anazariz, well said!
Hope is something... that people say "dies last"   As anazariz said, I too, want just want to know.
Styleworks I believe is the only software that is able to do fun stuff with styles, but it is way outdated and clunky.

I think users deserve a simple answer from Dan. I do not believe that is too much to ask. Dan, please answer.
Thank you.

[Dan]

Hello Friends,

I am still alive and still 100% motivated on adding new features to vArranger or correcting problems you can encounter
Yes, Style creator is the n°1 of the important feature for vArranger to add, and for sure I will do it
I don't plan to charge any money for this feature.
I don't ask money for updates since 8 years. If you use and enjoy some of the features added on a new version, Paypal donation is allowed

The vArranger style creator will not be a complete sequencer like cubase etc...  I have in mind a very simple tool to record few tracks, and set few rules for the arranger. It will not create or edit Ketron, Yamaha, Korg, Roland Technics styles.... It will be a new vArranger style format
Import tracks from other styles is important for us and is in the plan. But editing possibilities on such tracks will probably not be possible

[zeljko]

Bravo Dan.

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
and what is the priority number for implementation of SD1000 effectprocessor ,,save and load efx1,2 settings" with save and load song? This is missing from some SD1000 users in the last years! You have also promised this function some years ago!

Best regards
Werner

[anazariz]

I am glad that you're alive and well

Simple style creation is what I was hoping for anyway. As I mentioned in previous posts, there are already tools out there for creating keyboard-specific styles and I don't view VA2 as providing such functionality.

When I come to VA2 I just need to be able to put a simple VA2-native style together "on-the-fly". But right now "on-the-fly" means jumping to multiple pieces of software

Thanks Dan.

[bluebeat]

Dan,  It is good to be alive!!! Welcome back

I am not sure how helpful this would be... but here it goes.
If I had the knowledge of programming I would do this for style mixer:

1)Have a folder where you "drop" the styles of any keyboard (Yamaha, Roland, Ketron etc) which you want to take advantage of.
2)Have these files batch universalised to proprietary ( VA format?) which would take all parts: Intros, mains, breaks and group them by type.
3) User assigns any part of the dissected (universalised) style to any part of  "user style"
4) User saves style, and plays through VA, like any other style.

I took time today and made a short clip of how Yamaha implemented pattern making on their sequencer app. Maybe it will give you some ideas.
Anyway, here it is:

https://youtu.be/2braY_NyQsY

Yamaha, had done this type of pattern / style creation since their QY70, 20 years ago (1997). Of course it was only for yamaha styles , but was very solid and stable.
If you interested in the logic, check out this youtube video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6xZ0XvsRGA

[anazariz]

What I had in mind was even simpler than that.
Directly record midi into a VA-style section and when done with all the sections save them as a single VA-style.

[Igor Electronician]

Hi Dan, hi Friends!

I want to express my opinion on editing options for styles. The only thing that is relevant is ability of revoicing, because a lot of interesting styles (vA2 of supported formats) for SD1000 played with not suitable timbres. For Yamaha synths created many such tools, including to create styles and edit CASM-section,  but for other brands there is nothing useful there. The same Ketron, for example...

[bluebeat]

Igor "relevant".... revoicing....  I do not follow you. Revoicing is not creating styles, it is what it is... "revoicing" ...
To change actual pattern lines and record your own lines to style that is more in the line of "style creator"
For example you like the drum part from one style in Ketron and bass line in Yamaha style, it would be nice to join them to one style with ease and THEN chose your "voice" for them.
I believe this thread is about style creator....

Игорь, хош, напиши мне на П.М. и я поделюсь мнением о звуках, может пригодиться.
всех благ.

[Igor Electronician]

To Bluebeat
Yes, yes, of course, buddy.

Написал в личку.

[DjTony1981]

I say mine:

I personally solved the "style creator" issue by purchasing the good EMC Style Works XT Universal by taking advantage of the Christmas offer at 250 Euros. So if we do 2 calculations: vA2 = 349 Euro, Style Works = 250 Euro, KETRON SD1000 = 379 Euro (bought because i was surprised by Dan's DEMO videos), TOTAL = 978 Euros. If we consider that the Roland BK5, the KETRON Midijay Plus (with a few extra euros) has ALL INCLUDED, without bugs, customizable and with "style creator", it gets me some nervous .. i am confident in Dan to be able to have AT LEAST a more functional and versatile product of this .. even without creator, but STYLE EDITABLE (easier to realize). The only time Dan responded quickly and corrected vA2 was when I noticed an incorrect chords recognition, which of course for Auto-Accompaniment software is not a "little bug".
I thinks, at ends, that Dan is probably working alone, and maybe he does not live with only vA2 retributions, so he should start looking for collaborators, or possibly selling the vA2 project to a large company with a number of staff to carry out the project in a short time..more, I repeat, for the moment I " turn the bales "..

[bluebeat]

DjTony1981, I tried EMC and personally I think it works, BUT it is way (WAY!!!) outdated, overpriced, underdeveloped and not a user friendly product.  I know, it is only one "universal" at the moment... but looks like developer gave up on it years ago . I sincerely hope this will not be a case with Dan.  Your point on collaborators, I believe is excellent and would be the perfect solution to ease the pain of people who are waiting for long time to get certain bugs fixed or minor features added.

Here is a life story and maybe a suggestion.

When I built my site (not related to music) it was all custom made for me, with a lot of tricky stuff and such. When my friend developer got a full time job and was not able to do it for me at the pace I needed, I hired a programmer and she done sections of work for me at reasonable rate on demand.

Average coders get 18-30 Euro an hour
Good coders 40-60 Euros
Best - more

.. Anyway the point I am trying to make is this: 
To get the code written for stylemaker/editor I would estimate about 60-80 hours of programming, given that some base work is already done and the idea path is laid out. With good coder, labor will cost roughly 2500-3000 euros.
Dan can ask hundreds of his customers who can contribute to project and just subcontract somebody who can do the code work. That would be my approach, if time did not permit to invest in the project.   Dan would keep his rights and credits, somebody will get a job gig and many of us would be happy.... And most likely Dan will be able to sell more copies of VA.

Also

To spark interest for bigger donations Dan can offer one of his soundbanks for free as a promotion, with donations lets say of 100 Euros to the style making project

[anazariz]

While I initially suggested compensating Dan for the development, which I still do, I believe that 100 Euros is a bit too steep. First off, I like DjTony1981's Total Cost calculation. But I'd like to make a minor change to it (by the way, I rounded the numbers for simplicity). 

Total Cost = (VA2 = 350 Euros) + (Style Works = 250 Euros) + (KETRON SD1000 = 380 Euros) + (Usage%  * Computer Cost = Euros)   -------- Wow I paid a lot more for my SD1000 

One might say that adding the cost of a computer to VA2 would not be fair. Nonetheless, VA2 would not run without a computer so some percentage of the cost of computer would get added to the cost of VA2. I have a dedicate music computer (I think most of you do as well). So for me the percentage would be around (20% for VA2) and (80% for Cubase and other related software). For me that translates to around 200 Euros.  Also, in my case the "Style Works" component gets switched with "Cubase and StyleMagic and a couple of other tools I use for style making", which comes up to about the same.

Anyhow, in my case the Total Cost comes to: 350 + 250 + 380 + 200 = 1180. Adding another 100 Euros would put the total cost substantially over the cost of a similar product (like PK-7M).

All that said, I like the product and want to support it. I am willing to support Dan's Style Creator efforts with 30-40 Euros. I also would support future major updates (not bug fixes, which most companies deliver for free) with as much as 30 Euros for annual major feature releases (or half that for semi-annual releases). I also think that the decision of what goes into a major feature release could be voted on by the user/customer community.

[anazariz]

By the way, if a Style Creator is added, the Total Cost of the VA2 drops drastically. Total Cost = 350 + 0 (this cost eliminated) + 380 + 200 = 930. This would put VA2 on a completive price point with PK-7M.

[bluebeat]

Anazaris, I believe you misunderstood me. I said: to incurrage larger donations, Dan could offer one of his soundbank for free to those who donate 100 euros...

I think standard  donation of 10-40 euro to bring such feature to life would be fair, but those who might want to try Dan's soundbanks, it might be an opportunity to do both.

Anyway, theories, theories....

Dan, just find somebody who can code for you on hourly or project base. I know, it is not very easy to find somebody good and reasonable, but on the other hand it is not terribly complicated stuff.

[anazariz]

Sorry bluebeat, I did misunderstand. 10-40 Euros sounds reasonable.

[nikola]

Ah Friends we have a lot to waiting for vA2...

Regards.

[DjTony1981]

I forgot to add, by the very least, the cost of the computer, that is, a second-hand LINQ tablet with Windows 10 found on eBay at about 75 Euros (perfect, a real deal). With this I compensated for the possibility of using vA2 with the touch and not with a KORG nanoKontrol2 .. so we get close to 1000 Euros.

bluebeat ... Style Works XT is not obsolete at all and difficult to use, obviously it has a "base" knowledge of how styles work and how it is programmed, but I find the Import-Export style to MIDI FILE functions very useful , and thanks to XGWorks I can edit and optimize the riffs, especially when converting MIDI FILE to STYLE to a MIDI FILE song in style. Also Style Works is a project born around 1997-1998, so work and bugfix were made with respect to vA2 at the moment..

[bluebeat]

DjTony, Styleworks does have logic and it works, do not get me wrong, but user interface and whatever clutter of code that was used to write it,  is close to obsolete. It just I hope that something better comes up in the future.  A friend has it, I tried it on i7 machine...  

So Dan do not think this forum is for whiny babies, I got to give him credit. Dan, VA is an awesome program!  Since I bought it, I have composed over 25 vocal tracks with backing tracks I made on VA. It got me in musical spirit again   Thank you!

But I ask you, to please consider some of very interesting ideas that people share here. Good deeds pay off eventually.

[DjTony1981]

A small step forward (and simpler, I guess) for style creator would be that vA2 might have a proprietary style format, perhaps a MIDI file type (such as Yamaha's styles) with all its volume, sounds params, rev, and cho editable parameters which through a Cubase-type software, users can edit and customize styles (Ketron, Roland etc ..) loaded in memory.. I hope Dan gives us an answer about it ..