SD1000 Effectprocessor

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
in this forum there are many discussions about new features for VA2!

But what is with not finished implementations of in VA2 integrated functions?
For example my old wish for the effectprocessor of the SD1000!

What is your priority number in your TODO List for implementation of SD1000 effectprocessor ,,save and load efx1,2 settings" with save and load song? This is missing from some SD1000 users in the last years! You have also promised this function some years ago!

Best regards
Werner

[Dan]

I am working again on the SD1000 DSP FX engine
I am adding now few presets
The documentation has some mistake, so it is a bit hard to know what is really implemented or not......

[Carlo]

Hi Dan,

What is your priority number in your TODO List for implementation of SD1000 effectprocessor ,,save and load efx1,2 settings" with save and load song? This is missing from some SD1000 users in the last years!

I also need a "Save" and "Load"-Function of the SD1000 Effectprocessor.

Regards,
Carlo

[jolon28]

Dan, I'm glad to hear you about adding some presets.  In the documentation of the SD1000, there are many presets. My wish is to get, at least, all the presets of Modulation (Chorus/Phaser/tremolo/rotary/Flanger).

As Carlo said, save&load of FX in the songs or midifile would be great !

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
very good news!
Take a look at this datasheet, because the SD1000 datasheet misses some SYSEX!

https://www.dream.fr/pdf/Serie5000/Firmwares/Firm5716-EK.pdf

This is for SAM5716 and should also work for SAM3xxx in the SD1000.

[Dan]

I am now on the Distortion module. We can see

3xh 63h Type: 0=Tube, 1=asymmetric parabolic1, 2=asymmetric parabolic2

So the type is only 0 , 1 or 2

But in the preset list of Distortion we can see type values = 0 to 7

Also there is column called  Low Lev Cut, but I don't see any NRPN for this

[Dan]

Also the RC LP Filter 3xh 68h from the SD1000 manual does not seem to be present

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
yes, there is something wrong!
I will contact Klaus from V3Sound. He has a good connection to DREAM! And also i  have the EMAIL address from the chief developer of the SD1000!
If Klaus has no info i will contact Ketron!

[Dan]

So please ask for the full HQ Distorsion documentation too, as it is not available on the Ketron SD1000 documentation, nor in the DREAM documentation

[haweneu]

Hi,
EMAIL to the chief developer of Ketron and Klaus from V3Sound is sent!
regards Werner

[DjTony1981]

SD1000 uses SAM3816 CPU..

[jolon28]

I am now on the Distortion module. We can see

3xh 63h Type: 0=Tube, 1=asymmetric parabolic1, 2=asymmetric parabolic2

So the type is only 0 , 1 or 2

But in the preset list of Distortion we can see type values = 0 to 7

Lets us try to keep simple things as simple.

1- The value 3xh 63h defines the type of TUBE distorsion.
So we have 3 types of Tube distorsion
Tube
asymmetric parabolic1
asymmetric parabolic2.


2 - In the Distorsion presets list, we can see we have indeed a total of 13 distorsion presets.
These 3 Tube types are used to build 7 distorsion presets. 

3 - Since you are implementing presets, you have not to worry about the SysEx for individual parameters.

That means when you select, for example, the preset#10, you get a FUZZ distorsion and the 7 individual parameter values (Drive/Type/...Low Lev.Cut) are automatically set to the values listed in the table.

I use some of the 20 EFX presets listed in the SD1000 manual.
When I sent SysEx chain F0 26 7B 1A 13 00 3A F7 I get the Chorus1 effect, and I don't care about the SysEx for Chorus delay time or for Chorus feedback or other parameters. And the presets works fine!
They are just presets defined by Ketron.

There is still  a known issue about these presets : when a FX is inserted, we get a lower volume.

[Dan]

I will not implement SD1000 presets but I will recreate the presets by adjusting every parameters. This way, the FX screen will display what you hear, and it will be a good basis for adjusting

My main problem with the saving, is that I am not sure how to do it

Saving with the song, with the sound, DSP1 / DSP2... Stereo ....

[haweneu]

Hi,
practical example:

I play the song  ,,Atlantis" from the shadows.
There i want a sound ,,stopped guitar" with delay effect in my left2 sound. In the moment i load the song with the prior saved sound ,,stopped guitar" on left2 and then i adjust the EFX1 on left2 for delay.

Then i want to save the song with this effect at this sound on left2.

The same result is if i could save the sound with the delay and then save the song.

A separate DSP Save and Load function could also be very good! I could make my own DSP presets and select then with a sound a related own DSP preset!

[Carlo]

My main problem with the saving, is that I am not sure how to do it

Saving with the song, with the sound, DSP1 / DSP2... Stereo ....

Hello Dan,

The problem that i have :

The SD1000 produce a observable amount of Background-Noise. This Noise is even more reflected when i increase the high EQ-settings on my Mixing-Console.

I can also increase the EQ-settings on the SD1000 Effect-processor, instead of on my Mixing-Console.
This way, the SD1000 sounds a little more briljant, and there is no increase of the Background-noise produced by the SD1000.

But here it comes, every time i launche vArranger i have to set (reset) the EQ-settings on the Effect-processor before i can start to play.

I just want a way to Save the EffectProcessor-Settings, so every time i launch vArranger, i can recall (re-Load) the Settings to send to the SD1000.

This will save me from the frustration to always reset the SD1000-EffectProcessor over and over again before i can start to play...

The best way for me would be to Save the EffectProcessor-Settings together with the Song,
so when i launch vArranger, i can simply recall and start a sort of Init-Song with the correct settings.
Or perhaps the integration of a "Save", "Load", and "Send"-button in the SD1000 EffectProcessor-Screen ?

Best Regards,
Carlo

[haweneu]

Hi,
i agree with Carlo!
But Dsp Settings in SD1000 effects menue  must then also be saved/loaded in combination with a sound!
Then the sound with related effect setting is save/loaded with a song.

My preferred method is Save/Load Effect settings with Song Save/Load.

[Dan]

This multi FX is very complex ...

Another thing to consider :

You can use as 2 distinct multi effect processor. So you can use it for 2 different sounds. For exemple a guitar with disto + delay + chorus  and on left hand an organ + leslie + disto + eq

Or use the 2 DSP for only ONE stereo sound.

I have noticed that if the source is a stereo sound, it is important to use the FX in stereo mode (improved the reset button) , because for exemple the grandpiano sounds bad when converted to mono before entering DSP1

However, mono sources in one DSP can result in a stereo output, by adding a chorus or delay FX

So it really depends...

Also, you can mix many tracks to use the same DSP chain....

Also, I think some of the settings, like the global EQ, should probably better SAVED as GLOBAL or per SONG and not per sound....

Too many options, and deciding one way, is also limiting it.... That's the only reason I waited so much time to save this MFX

Korg, Yamaha, Ketron, Roland also decided for the user....   They set some dsp settings in the style, and some in the OTS. Sometimes it works ok, but then you can't use the same OTS in another style...

Uh...  By the way, I finished to add the first preset if someone want to test

[Dan]

I am just trying, and the main EQ of the EFFECT screen is not working at all anymore with my SD1000

This is very strange, as probably it has worked before, and carlo seems to use it too.

Maybe because my SD1000 is version 1.4?

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
if you finshed one test preset please send the program for tests to me.

Klaus from V3 Sound sent me the firmware doku from his Sonority.
Its a special SAM5716 Firmware version for V3Sound from 2017.
Klaus will publish it at his homepage!

But it contents the same error at the distortion with type numbers greater than 2!
I reported this to V3Sound and also last sunday to Ketron!
Now answer from Ketron!

[Dan]

I think better to ask to Dream directly...

I sent you the DSP test version

Note that when you change from mono to stereo, you need to click on RESET ALL, so set it well

[haweneu]

Hi,
yes, Klaus has a good connection to Burkhard Beneke from Dream!
I will tell Klaus to contact Dream.

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
i didnt receive the DSP Testversion on my web.de account.
Please look to your EMAIL.
Werner

[Dan]

Sent again

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
that is very good!
Coloured Knobs! 
I tested some presets and it works well!

I need more time to test all variations! Many Many!!!

HQ Distortion type  should be a listbox and not rotary knob!


Save with Sound or song is not implemented at this version?

But it is amazing, to play a organ and can control the rotary!!! It would be great, if i could assign this function slow/fast of the rotary to a MIDI function via Controller menue!
Do you think this is possibe?


And a guitar with Delay and amp simulation (i hear no amp simulation with eq  in the moment) is also great.

A major step to a great arranger!

Best regards
Werner

[slaveofword]

Dan & everebody - good day for you!
I'm very glad to hear about this solution.

Dan, could you send me version vA2 for SD1000 to test it?

Many thanks!!

Andrew

[DjTony1981]

Dan, can i have this release too? Thanks..

I would like to report this problem also (with DSP-FX of SD1000). When I step from a style with an ACC FX sound to FX without sound, the SD1000 does not reset the DSP-FX in the ACC track. Try this style..

[haweneu]

Hi DjTony,
this is an known effect that i posted some time ago!
If you load a new song, you should ,,Reset All Effect" in the effect menue prior to load.
This resets all effect.

Dan cannot know if he load a song, what effects are active in the SD1000, because we cannot read back the SD1000 content!

If Dan has implemented the new dsp load and store with song or sound this problem is solved!

[Igor Electronician]

Hi Dan, 
Hi Friends!
By the way, for some reason the most common effect "Reverb" with many presets (Room, Hall, Plate etc) in SD1000 not involved in effects panel and are not managed with the appropriate controls in mixer tracks. Is it possible to implement use of presets?

[haweneu]

Hi Igor,

you mean this SYSEX to control the reverb in SD1000:

  F0H 26H 7BH 00H 00H vv F7H
Reverb type (vv=0 to 7), default = 03H
(note 5)
10H : Room1 12H : Room3 14H : Hall2 16H : Delay
11H : Room2 13H : Hall1
15H : Plate
17H : Pan delay

I hope that dan can implement this!
The same thing is with chorus.

Best regards
Werner

[Igor Electronician]

Hi Werner,
yes, I meant these presets of Reverb.

With respect!
Igor

[DjTony1981]

older post..and there was the answer :

https://www.varranger.com/vforum/index.php?topic=3319.0

[Igor Electronician]

Hello,
I do not see there answer of developer. The topic contained only some assumptions user vA2... Let's say that management team effects in SD1000 and SD2 are different, but for this there is in settings there is a choice of mode. Depending on the selected mode may be transmitted to MIDI command specific to a particular type of sound module. At appropriate level to answer this question can only be respected Dan. Another problem is that Ketron very poorly represents information in the technical documentation for their products. In addition, there may be various errors in documentation...

[DjTony1981]

I agree .. that post was created long ago, and there was no response from Dan .. so it's a born thing and dead in a short time, a symptom that will be difficult to accomplish .. sadly, Ketron than other music hardware manufacturers did not issue DEMO MIDI files to test the controls and sysex supported by the device .. a real shame ..

[Dan]

For you SD1000 lovers, I continue to work hard on this multi effects
I have added more controls and improving for the SD1000 MFX !!!!
Fixed the Main EQ
Added a main preset list = AMP model. You need to set each FX = ON to hear something
Added Reverb and Chorus controls

Very time consuming... experimenting on the SD1000, reading SD1000 manual, Dream Manuals, etc...

I was not able to change the LEVEL in the REVERB block.  The Dream message (GS) or the SD1000 message does not work.
But the Chorus level works with the Dream or Ketron sysex !

Saving / reloading all this will be crazy

[haweneu]

Hi Dan,
thank you for this final step at the SD1000.
Then i can play with VA2 as a hardware arranger keyboard!
I know this effect dsp controls are very hard to load and save!

PS
still no response from ketron about distortion type column in preset list. do you still need this info?
Then i will ask again!

Best regards
Werner

[Dan]

Better to get a contact directly from Dream, as they have created this firmware and not Ketron.

Note that I was not able to load HQ disto presets by sending the sysex

Yes the disto preset column show type 0 to 7, but the disto type values are 0 to 2. This is not logical.

Also if they can send you the HQ disto preset documentation as noticed on the SD1000 manual

And try the master volume reverb sysex not working too

[jolon28]

I have tested the Beta version of SD1000 effects.
Here are my comments.
See on the attached view : the numbers are referring to the paragraphs below.

1 – Chorus

The name of the preset 'Feedback Chorus' is too long regarding the size of the window.
I propose to replace the name with 'Feedback Cho' OR 'FB Chorus'  OR enlarge the window.

Last preset is named 'Short delay (FB)'. Why not save the same name as in the technical documentation : 'FB Delay' ?

2 – Reverb

We have 2 times the same window.
Type and character.
I don't know why.
Maybe, this section is not finished ?

3- Wrong channel numbers :

--- item deleted ----


4 – Rotary effect :
It works fine.

The only request should be to have a controller to switch from slow to fast.

5 – Modulation :
The windows is too narrow, and almost all the names of the preset are truncated.
Is it possible to enlarge this droplist window ?
Probably the whole Effects window would have to be enlarged : all that seems a little tight...

6 – Parametric Equalizer :

We have 2 times the same preset list. I don't know why.

Integration of the presets are a very good improvement for SD1000 users and for VArranger.
I think that good progress has been made since the beginning of the implementation of the SD1000 effects. I know too there is still much work to do...

[Carlo]

Hello Dan,

Can You send me the new version with the improved SD1000 EffectProcessor, please ?

Best Regards, and Thank You in Advance.

Carlo

[Dan]

OK

[slaveofword]

Dan, thank for your job!!!

could anyone suggest:
Can I manage these effects in real time with TouchOCS?
if so, what should you create (commands) in TouchOCS?

Thanks for any help!
With respect Andrey

[haweneu]

Hi,
if i am right, Touchosc can only control the Controllers in the ,,Controller menue" of VA2!
But i asked Dan to add a function for control SD1000 effect DSP with MIDI CC, for example the rotary slow/fast switch
of the SD1000 EFX DSP.

Best regards
Werner

[slaveofword]

Hi,
if i am right, Touchosc can only control the Controllers in the ,,Controller menue" of VA2!
But i asked Dan to add a function for control SD1000 effect DSP with MIDI CC, for example the rotary slow/fast switch
of the SD1000 EFX DSP.

Werner, good day.
but another question is: Is it possible to control effects of the SD1000 with TouchOSC directly? if it is- what should I write in the layout TouchOSC?
Thanks

[haweneu]

Hi,
not possible!

Werner