vArranger Forums

To summarize many drums (+ percussion channel) are not converted correctly from vArranger to standard GM mode modules, and I believe the most logical solution is a possibility to change global drum maps, corresponding to the style played. So you do not change the particular style or particular drum set, but only a map.

Dan,
various random styles... (for different keyboards)
Maybe, just a suggestion.  Halion Sonic SE is free (If you do not have one already) I believe it shares same GM library as full version.  Just try it to see how random styles play for you.
I find Sonic much more intuitive than Kontakt, and unlike Kontakt (Sampletank, etc) It has GM / Program change feature.

I believe the biggest challenge is not wrong instruments playing, but the drum mapping and percussion channel. I do not see why this can not be done in vArranger.  Re-Map can be applied before it goes out from vArranger.  Drums where always a challenge in vA for me.  If vArranger truly supports multi format styles, drum maps should be a part of vArranger, not to re-map manually each kit externally for individual styles. There only 5 or so popular maps and having the right one, makes huge difference.

Lylo,
my computer can handle VA + Sonic just fine. I do not need to be conservative on computer resources to sacrifice stability.
By optimization,I meant for the styles to play more or less correctly.

As I mentioned: Free, random GM SF2 bank found on internet loaded in vsynth plays styles more correctly than Sonic.
This should not be like this. I hope this is making more sense now.

Lylo, I tried that,made no difference. Actually VA hanged on me couple of times with Halion loaded as VST. It is much more stable when in standalone mode with virtual cable. What bothers me is this. If I take a free, very basic GM SF2 font, it plays fine styles made for Roland or Yamaha. Percussion channel 9, mapped correctly and overall, it might sound cheap, but correct.

Halion Sonic is the only current professional software with GM mode and it does not play correctly  most of styles. Probably my requests will not be heard, but I feel that VA would benefit proper GM conversion to module (percussion!  especially) and several popular drum maps that can be applied on output. Similar to Drummica, that has several maps and in most cases, one would work properly with any given style when using VA.

GM hardware modules are the past.  There is almost nothing produced these days specifically for GM midi except for high end arranger keyboards that have that feature. Stuff is done through software. I believe that things which I mentioned should be done at the "source" (in this case VA) not on output.

Folks, Dan I have couple of questions to those who use Halion Sonic with vArranger.
I use it as a standalone/main "sound module" with Varranger, using virtual Midi cable, not as VST.
It works, but every time things have to be re-voiced heavily, no matter which style it is for Yamaha, Roland etc. Is it possible to optimize it to play well with vArranger, similar to vSynth?  I do use GM mode of Halion of course. I have tried switching varranger Midi outputs to GM, GM2, XG(thinking that Halion is Yamaha), made no difference.

Any suggestions please?

Thank you.

Ok, I think the guy who posted solution with image (it is in French...) Meant "Disable full screen optimization".
That was not it. I figured it out. Here is the solution. See attached. Volumes working.

P.S. Dan, since it seems you are in good spirits, can you answer couple of things about Halion Sonic.... I will start a new topic, as it maybe  interesting to other memeber

Dan,
I had dejavu... I remember asking for option of audio outputs to "none" if using external sound source.
What about volume meters? Some light up on high volumes, some do not at all...

Dan, I also noticed that track volumes indicators do not light up.... Using Halion OR Varranger Synth.
I had Error 46 on my previous computer. This is new installation, still :46 error...

Maybe my version has bugs?

midi port screen

v.muller,
Thank you for solving mystery! (I do not believe this is in the manual)

Best regards,
Misha.

Hi fellows.
In "Song chords"
What is 1+8 and 1+5 refers to?
Can somebody please let me know.
Thank you.

Hi Dan.
Keep getting this error on startup:
Error_WASAPI_init: 46...
See attached. After I press "OK" it starts normal. This error popping up every time I start VA.
Do you know how to fix that?

Thank you in advance.

I think his best bet would be SF2 bank using vSynth.
There are free and paid for. Maybe they do not sound the "best", but work out of the box, no wires no connections.
I think for beginner that would be a choice #1.
Open VA and start playing.

Barry,
if you are arranger fan, you probably remember how much PSR500 was? It was groundbreaking for the time! If you had bought that at original price in early 1990, would you still be comparing it with current models...which are almost same price as that one was if you take inflation into account?

I watched vArranger for a long time before I made a purchase. Last major update was vsynth, that is what got me sold. After that only relatively small progress. 

vArranger is outgoing technology, but still can shine years to come and have very creative uses.  I personally think that Dan has to do the right thing and push vArranger a notch up. And I honestly do not care if he drops the price to 150 euro or so, to have the cash flow to stay busy on software / get help, or charges reasonable fee for features (*not for bug fixes) rather than see it go to limbo .

What saddens me the most, that there is no open discussion... from Dan or users. No timeline (or any solid confirmation for that matter) to develop new bold features, not just minor adjustments. No backup plan (remember Live-Styler?)...

Dan, I do not blame you, you are just a human, but I feel that time is running out to make right choices on vArranger before it becomes too dusty. I am saying this not to hurt you, but because I care for the future of your soft. Please re-think strategy to breeze some life into vArranger.

Final chapter.
BIAB, finally after many years of holding back released 64bit version and a VST.
VSTsynthfont developer made a big push last year to polish his VST and got contracted by PG, promoting his work to thousands of users!

Dan, your turn now

Ok...
Dan if you have Cakewalk, please open this Midi, see where the start is. Midi file was not modified, straight from VA.
Thanks.

Lylo,
Not terribly important, I can find the start of the first note. I was just curious why vArranger is doing this.

Dan,
Not when it plays in Varranger... Starts on "Start" button.
I believe when you use "song chords" for arrangement,  varranger re-compiles style to midi file.

...And what you said earlier, leaves "One musical bar"...

But this is not one bar, not even 2 bars... something else. Can you please explain?

Dan,
Please see attached image. Am I not reading it right? But it seems more than one bar...
Kindly let me know.
Thanks.

Hi Folks, Dan.

I have a question. At "Song Chords" when I have the arrangement... I do "Export" to save it as Midi file.
When I open that midi file in Daw, it does not start from the "start" it has a few seconds of silence (all tracks)
Is this normal?

Please let me know.
Thanks.

I do not believe it is a "big" project for one person, but it is a big project for one person who is only partially engaged in it.  I would love to see vArranger evolve,  especially now when computers got very fast, so there is almost no hardware limitation. Several very good suggestions were offered to Dan on this forum. I support the idea of modular updates.

Fix bugs / maintain to have compatibility with future windows updates - free.

And have annual comprehensive cumulative updates packages which would include new features and requests - paid, with proper pricing structure: discounted for somebody who supports yearly and to people who want to do it every few. As most software these days.

avis71, Real tracks are not like midi. You can not change the chords on fly for real tracks to  follow in live scenario. You can make/render a backing track and play "to it" with vArranger I guess.

KeyOfZ, not sure what you are saying...
You render (export) individual files in BIAB (unmixed, dry and centered). Each of the exported waves do   adhere to timeline in DAW and work very well with samples other than from BIAB source.  These are your stems...  I use BIAB, not Realband, so can only speak for what I had been doing.

Rest and holds are tricky, but if you have non BIAB files that are in sync, it is easy cut and move things around (before/after shot, hold , rest).
If  items are not to sync, such as VA exported WAVs , you have to do crazy tricks to make them work, like transients  and all that good stuff, which is pain in butt.

Hi Dan.
I think one of the features to nicely  benefit "Drum mixer" would be a choice of popular drum maps of hardware. Similar to Sennheizer Drummica.
If I use that VST for drums and some notes (hits) are wrong, I just put drums on solo and try a different map and one of them will sound good.

 Pierre,
tracks of vArranger sync well to themselves, but not to true timeline.
If you are working how you describe, going straight with midi, that is one thing and it should work
because midi is easy to fix.
To use Vsynth and export WAV so it matches true timeline/bpm , as Dan explained, would need to be based on clock. (Because vArranger does not adhere to particular clock). Dan recently said that he is working on Sync In that would solve that. I am waiting for that feature very patiently 

Dan,
Thank you for the update! Please make it right. This is a very important core feature, I am sure it will be very appreciated.

Thank you.

Well, that is one way,  but being able to export different lines as waves from vArranger from various styles, on demand is more to my taste. Since there are no style maker  in vArranger, having a midi clock that would match Daw is the quickest solution to reach this goal...  Just waiting for Dan to complete Midi sync in.

v.muller, why would somebody want to do that?
BIAB is about realtracks.
Realtracks are exported as audio files, not midi (because they are audio files)
Arrangements from vArranger can be exported as WAV or Flac files also, but they do not adhere to timeline in DAW, because they are not synced to a specific clock.
Dan promised to make sync in option a few weeks ago. Waiting for that to happen

Hi Dan.
Happy New Year!

Can you please tell me and those who are interested if any progress was made on Midi Sync In feature?

Thank you.

I am patiently waiting too for Sync In, with my fingers crossed.

Ok.

I already tried couple of things, so I know they work to extent.
It is fairly straight forward. BIAB has great "live" tracks but does not have many
good intros, fill ins, endings and large variety of midi lanes, such as styles in VA do.
So, here is the workflow:

1)I create arrangement in BIAB and export them as individual WAV files
2)I use same SGU (Biab format) in Varranger to import chord sheet (Dan
made that available and it works)
3)choose a style in VA, set tempo same as BIAB/DAW project, rearrange fill ins, breaks endings. Record individual WAV files
4)I import all files to DAW and mix BIAB files with Arranger files.
5) Mixdown either as WAV or MP3. c'est ça

Here is the biggest challenge that hopefully Dan will solve within next days. Sync In... Wav files from VA are not of exact tempo, so when I did couple of arrangements, I had to use Audio snap tool, chopping and aligning VA tracks so they are in sync with the rest of the project. That is not very smart way to do it and it is very tedious  process.

So my hope with SYNC IN is to either sync VA to a smaller program as midiclock? as Dan suggested to record WAVs using vSynth SF2 bank.
Also with another scenario, of using just midi, to record directly to DAW using Halion Sonic or VSTSynthfont as VST hosts in DAW, also SYNC IN to DAW project, so all things have proper tempo.

I hope that explains the process.

BIAB has released new version, which is 64 bit! and they made a VST also. Major breakthrough for them! Also, they have sale period, which ends on Dec 31. They only do these "sales" once a year. If you can pick up a valid new licence of 2018 version at a cheaper cost from third party, they will upgrade to 2019 at no cost.

Finally my "dream" composition bundle of Varranger+BIAB  is coming to life! One of the final pieces to the puzzle is for Dan to complete clock Sync In option. That way files from BIAB will sync properly to files from vArranger in DAW.    Varranger and BIAB are like yin and yang. Two very special and very diverse programs for arranging and composition. One can not substitute the other. Together, they can make magic.

P.S. Maybe one day Dan decides to make a VST also. I think, if it happens, it will be very fair if he markets it separately. One price to new users and for discounted price for loyal customers, to keep project fueled.

Forgot to mention, it is fairly light (aluminum casing) and has a standard 4 holes for Vesa mount!

They must have changed the link, or link is dynamic.

It is on their site, model: T156C
15.6 inch 1920 * 1080 IPS FHD Touch Screen with USB-C/HDMI Input

They just came out with that monitor. I was searching for a long long time for something like this. As I understand (not official) they bought some close-out  hardware items from Sony, that explains good quality of the panel.

https://magedok-shop.myshopify.com/products/15-6-inch-1920-1080-ips-fhd-touch-screen-with-usb-c-hdmi-inputt156c

Hi fellows.
To whom it might be interesting...

For a long time I was trying to find an all in one solution for secondary monitor.  I have tried various wireless options direct, computer to computer and through router connections (Miracast wireless display connection). I have tried wired and wireless PC to Android connections. All of these worked to degree...of monitoring, but latency was high to consider it to be doubled as a touch controller. Finally found a perfect companion for my laptop. The brand is Magedok. They have a variety of monitors. The one I bought is a 15.6 inches USB -C gen 2  Touchscreen monitor. What does that mean... If you have a USB-C gen 2/Thunderbolt3  port on your computer, you only need a single cable from your PC for Power, Video and Touch! If you have the right port, no drivers needed for win 10, Plug& Play. Monitor is not glossy, so that made me happy too. Most important, it is very robust, almost no latency at all. Compared to other options- it is a rocket.  Built very well.  I thought it might interest  somebody.


https://magedok-shop.myshopify.com/products/15-6-inch-1920-1080-ips-fhd-touch-screen-with-usb-c-hdmi-inputt156

Dan,
Thank you! I sincerely hope it will correct issues with tempo. I am sure people who record will appreciate this feature very much. 

P.S. While you are in progressive spirit, I thought I would bring this up one more time. Please consider a way to disable vSynth without uninstalling it.
Similar to when you go to OPTIONS-->MidiPorts  you can chose Midi IN or OUT (or Audio In) to none. Would be helpful if same could be applied to "Audio Out" to "none"...to bypass vSynth. So for instance, if a person (me or anyone else) wants to use vArranger as a MIDI only device, it would not use computer/audio resources.

Thank you!

Dan, Can I please try the Beta (Alpha?) version with "sync in" option?
Thank you.

Dan,
if Sync In would work, it would solve a big headache with Audio and live midi stream and a step toward a system that could replace hardware sooner.
If Midi Clock is not internal, I think it would be better to use DAW clock. Or I guess if the option is there, you can use anything that works.
Just simple instructions please to use with DAW.

Dan, please, let me try beta.

P.S. I promise to behave well

Arranger can be for live music or non live music. It is for arranging songs.  If vArranger does not have a basic audio output that has a correct tempo, it can not be compared with hardware arrangers. 

I have tried over 25 (TWENTY FIVE!) different scenarios with different audio cards, different computers, different sound sets, different drivers,different buffer setting, running latencymon, disabling non essential drivers, airplane mode, recording from computer to computer and a few other things.

Dan, life is short and "future" is very flexible word. How about a deal. Fix tempo issue (rigid time grid), so recorded WAVs are of the correct tempo (as they should be) and I will not post to this forum in the future, except for update requests when these come out.

Let me know.

Dan, if I was asking for a candy, I would be nice. For something that came as a very unpleasant surprise and being ignored, yes it is frustrating.
Especially when I invested many hours of trying to resolve this.

You read Agaton comments, why not tell him that whatever "tuning" he does, will not fix tempo issues? He believes otherwise...

P.S.  Keep in mind that you are doing good not for me personally, but for your program, your current and future customers.
I was very calm when yearly update did not include anything I have asked for for long time. For example SAVE/OPEN VST with project or at least fix scaling of VST loading screen.
It is very strange that you did not do that, but I do realize it is optional, therefore I have no say in it. Wrong tempo is a problem, not a "option request".

Thank you.

It seems to me that whenever "uncomfortable" topic arises, it suddenly gets quiet here.
Dan, vsynth was the deciding factor for me to buy varranger.  If I knew  that it would output broken temp files, I would probably rethink the purchase and would not of recommended to the people as I did.  Please let me know if you are intending to fix this the right way, internally? Not through some unorthodox way with third party dependent programs.

P.S. And maybe relieve Agaton, so he does not waste time trying to "ride a car with square tires on a highway"
He is convinced that his computer will output file with correct tempo through vsynt +SF2 ...

Thank you.

another try, another fail...

Yes, I am waiting for that file like a child for Santa Clause!
Agaton, do not make child cry!

Agaton,
You do not read thread properly. Roland or not Roland. I have tried different styles with same chord grid. VA files sync together WELL TO THEMSELVES BUT NOT TO TEMPO GRID OR SYNC TO OTHER NON VA FILES.

Bottom line: Audio recordings from Varranger using vsynth+SF2 bank in Sample folder have exponential latency that is internal to vsynth, not hardware. I want Dan to fix this latency issue, so files are usable.

Dan, I had run more tests.
Here is what I found. I used SAME chord grid for DIFFERENT styles in VA of different makers/genres. I recorded audio through vArrranger "audio rec".
(vSynth+SF2).

Result: They are all in sync with each other, but NOT to other items outside VA.  Files from VA have the SAME latency pattern. ON ALL OF THEM!!!

Different audio cards / buffers do NOT solve this! (That is why I believe Agaton is quiet after HoT debate ) I tried at least 20 scenarios on 2 different computers.

This is internal to your synth. Is is possible to fix this?

Dan,  this is a bit ridiculous approach.... Like a witch soup. Why do this?

Please name one musical program developed in the past 10 years that would output file that is by design of the program is out of sync with timeline  and BPM.
BIAB, FL, Yamaha Mobile Music Sequencer, recorded WAV samples, hardware sequencers just to name a few...
None of these would have internal tempo problem / latency as much as VA has.

Unless latency is created by hardware, which Agaton argues.  His problem is he does not realize the core problem of latency / tempo mismatch is internal to vsynth
when hits sounds from "SAMPLES" folder and no "hardware tuning" will ever solve this.

Dan, I do not think I am asking much to have the recorded audio be usable in standard project grid of DAW. There must be a non science fiction way to address this.

Thanks.

Hmm Dan, I am not a specialist, but...
I can not grasp what you are describing....
You need WASAPI exclusive to avoid latency.  You can not have 2 WASAPI exclusive in VA and DAW at the same time. DAW would not play a project if exclusive control is taken by VA and wise versa.

If you mix WASAPI / ASIO in live setup, that too might create latency issues.
Why not implement internal clock.  Have a tick on vSynth follow clock / not follow clock?

Dan, I do not believe what you are proposing is a solution with using SF2 bank + varranger synth. We had this discussion before. About a year ago. It was about streaming audio (not midi) to DAW. There was no proper solution/resolution to stream sound to DAW from varranger. Somebody hinted that it might work with some high end cards that allow multiple virtual streams. I think the only solution is what you mentioned....: Have proper Tempo when BMP is fixed.

I care about whole arrangement following BPM /  proper tempo map using vsynth+sf2 bank.....

Dan, why are you keep on referring to "recording VA to DAW"?   VA can not record audio from vsynth SF2 bank on a normal / average system. Why are you keep mentioning that? Can you please explain.

Thank you.

Dan, I am not sure what my DAW has to do with vArranger vSynth.....
All this time, I am talking about WAV files recorded in vArranger.
vSynth+SF2 bank = Audio rec, in varranger not DAW record...

As I understand, most audio programs that deal with midi/audio have internal midi clock.

Dan, please.
I bought vArranger to make arrangements without the correct tempo, they are not usable.
Not sure what you mean by MIDI SYNC... As long as outputted WAV files from vsynth using SF2 banks have correct tempo, that should solve it.
Can you please make that happen.

Stewbow,
thank you for your reply.  Do not give into the idea that files from vArranger can not be in sync. It is not science fiction. There can be, and there should be an option for the people who will use these files outside VA to have vsynth adhere to correct tempo.  I am afraid it is more than time stretching.  Seems more like a TEMPO MAP + LATENCY problem, which can be corrected within vArranger and not with performing surgeries in DAW. What bothers me is that:
Dan is ignoring this topic.

I gave up  many hopes & dreams concerning vArranger.  But this, if Dan does not fix it, would be a final stab in the back.

VA Outputted wav files are not of correct tempo., which makes them useless when using them with files with correct tempo.


P.S. Not sure where Agaton disappeared. I seriously doubt that his "tuned" computer will spit out WAV from vArranger that has correct BPM and correct Tempo map. Yet to see that magic.

Agaton, any news on the Mp3 or Wav? I am very interested to  know if you are right about it.
thank you.

Agaton, if you are saying it is my computer....
Please help, by playing and recording the style in attachment (I believe you need both files to play it)   it is  105BPM using your TA SF2 set in SAMPLES folder. Using vSynth, not Kontakt, recording as  "Audio rec" in vArranger.

If your MP3 (or WAV) will sync to my 105 BPM DAW project, I will take my words back, apologize and listen to you.
Thank you.

Dan, Agaton...
As I said, I might be wrong at some things... but this is scenario:

1)I render drums in BIAB at 105 BPM

2)Go to Cakewalk....create new project 105BPM.

3)Import that WAV into project. All beats on right bars, where they should be, metronome synced. Everything perfect. If I import something from other
places, like sample library that has full instrumental parts 105BPM  (WAV, not MIDI), they will also sync well to the project

4)If I "audio record" track from vArranger as WAV, using vSynth+SF2 bank, and import that file to the same DAW project......
It will stay in sync for about 15-20 seconds, with other tracks (and metronome) and then it will not stay in sync for the rest of the song.  It does not adhere to standard tempo, set in that project.

Yes, agaton, precisely.
So if you use independent metronome (which would be the same in Africa , China or Australia), recorded wav files from vSynth will be out of sync, where audio files from most other software will be in sync. That is a problem I am trying to resolve. Not anything else.

Dan, seems agaton knows something you don't... He thinks it is my setup and not what you said: "vArranger recording, is a "what you hear" recording, and is not in sync with any reference clock"...

Can you please shine a light on this. Thank you.

Agaton,
Here is your track on 131 BPM project. See attached. There is no "secret" ways of importing your track. This is how it imports to DAW into 131BPM project.
If this is 131 BPM to you, that is ok with me. Agaton, maybe I am wrong at some things...sure, but so far I have not heard anything worthy accept that I have bad computer, s#it Asio interface(s), and do not know what I am talking about.

Thank you for trying, but  as I mentioned, I am more interested in what Dan has to say about this.

No Audio IN.
More of a problem that VA remembers last setup (Audio card) and does not want to change to anything else on the list.
But even this is "peanuts"- an annoyance....  compared to wrong tempo maps of outputted WAV files. That is a very serious problem. Dan, can you please answer that thread.
Thank you.

Agaton, yours is not 105BPM and NOT 131BPM as you said. Se attached. I do not even think it is from my file.
Agaton, what you did, is you compared 2 audio files from Varranger.... that you recorded. This was not the question.


Dan, I think you are having a bit of fun here, and I am not blaming you for it. Happiness is good thing.
But can you please stop this bizarre conversation and answer, if you can fix this, so vSynth adhires to card clock or whatever needs to be done, as the outputted WAV files from VA have bad tempo mapping.

Thank you.

Olivier, I tried internal card with WASAPI and ASIO4ALL   AND  2 dedicated external ASIO cards.
It is not because of the cards or computer setup. It is what Dan said. It does not send correct clock to vArranger synth when using SF2 files in SAMPLES directory.

Dan, we can discuss this until we turn "blue" with other members, but only you can solve this.

Please let me/us know.

Thank you.

Dan, while Agaton is trying to prove something, which I believe he will fail to prove... Can you please try to resolve this for me.
Please let me know.
Thank you.

ok, Agaton. Instead of saying nice things about my computer and interfaces, can you upload MP3 record from VA of style I posted using your Ta Sf2? (not Kontakt), SF2 bank, please.
Thank you.

Agaton, you are wrong. I have tried onboard card AND 2 Asio interfaces, Wasapi and Asio, 2 different computers.Different ASIO buffers. I did my homework.

I am sure Dan knows what is going on.

Here is image of WAV from VA at measure 4 and 40+

Agaton, for testing purposes.
Here are VA style file with chords (2 files) and MP3 105 BPM drums.
See if they are in sync after 20 seconds of playing.

Drums look perfect in DAW. Outputed VA WAV starts to have latency after 18 seconds and continues stretching that latency (or clock) or whatever it is called.... coming late.

Agaton,  thanks, I am sorry to say, but you are wrong. It has nothing to do with BIAB.
If it works for you, great. Dan knows exactly what I am talking about and hopefully will have a resolution for me.

I understand the explanation, but that does not resolve the issue.
Dan, can VA be tight to strong temporal grid (they got it from the audio card clock)? So everything is in sync?

Agaton, I am using TA SF2 bank, no VSTS.
I just tried your way and used predefined tempo of one style that was 112 BPM in VA, outputted one from BIAB of 112 BPM,
They are not synced. So predefined or not it they are not in sync. 

Dan, If I take two projects of different tempos in BIAB and use  same chord sets and lets say if one project is 110BPM and another 90... Set them both to 100 and output wav files from two different sessions, they would sync properly to Cakewalk project that is 100.

How it is possible to resolve this, so outputted VA WAV files are in sync with ones from BIAB?  I only use 3 main programs BIAB, VA and Cakewalk. Please help.

Dan, this is a bit confusing for me.
Here is actual example:
vA project set to 105 BPM (in vA)
BIAB project (source) set to 105 BPM
DAW project is set to 105 BMP
+ Midi in DAW....

In DAW, everything plays well, except for  WAV files from vA. They are synced among other VA WAV files, but not to the rest of the project.

Not sure what you mean by "slave clock".  To me, it should work like this: If I set tempo in VA to 105BPM, it should output files as 105BPM. If I set it to 180BMP, it should output files that are 180BPM. Not something else.

Please let me know if it is possible to fix. I am sleeping very bad because of this.

Thank you.

Dan, I tried 2 other approaches, using a completely different computer and also connecting a second computer and recording tracks "live" to another.
There is a SUBSTANTIAL discrepancy within latency of your synth! I have over 100 arrangements (my own, not a "popular" song copied ones), that I have made in VA.
We are talking hundreds of hours of my time.  With this latency, it is not possible to render with proper tempo. Audio Snap in DAW does not work well, as your latency is exponential. What to do???

Dan, but this one is killing me. What to do about this latency issue? This is HUGE for me. I need to be able to use VA WAV files with the ones from BIAB.
I never had problems with Mixing BIAB WAV with other WAV files that are of the same tempo. I am not talking about a single project here.... I have many that are already done in VA that I wanted to use in DAW with BIAB WAV files.
Please let me know.

Hi Dan, thanks for task manager "on top" tip. Will do that.
With asio tricky. I tried all of the things on the list WASAPI, ASIO4ALL,DIRECT SOUND...... Spits same mistake about Asio error..
Again, this is after the session if I used external S.Card, close VA, disconnect external card----->restart VA.
I understand that this might be specific to setup, so as long as I can get to task manager, should be ok.

Dan, here are two instances where program gets stuck for me in very similar manner:

Scenario A) I use external soundcard, then close VA. Disconnect external card... to use Wasapi. VA "remembered" external card. When trying to switch to Wasapi, gives "ASIO error"

Scenario B) When switching instruments in Kontakt, sometimes Kontakt would ask something like: "changes will delete previous progress" and gets hanged...

The problem is, in both cases, you can not recall task manager to kill process, because VA is overlaying task manager screen. You can not get to task manager. Only solution for me was restart computer. It happened at least a dozen times already, so I decided to post this.

Dan, it is not that little at all !! It is more like: starts at 105 and ends at 102 BPM.
There is enormous latency within outputted track compared in reference to non VA track.

What to do about this? What seems to be the issue with "clock"?
I wish to use tracks for other compositions, but seems to be not possible? 

P.S. Dan, in the past several month I have met some people that are very good at at solving software problems and they are musicians. If you can not figure the "clock", I can gladly try asking them on your behalf.

Please let me know.
Thanks.

No solution of having VA Wav file to play together with non VA Wav file in sync??

Dan,  You are not correct. We talked about the INDIVIDUAL tracks from VA. They are in sync with each other. There is no problem there, but there is a latency between VA tracks and other, non VA WAV file. Is there a way to correct this?

Hi Dan / fellows.

Can somebody comment on this.... I have an audio track (not from VA) and when I add exported Audio from VA I get latency, compared to the track not from VA.
When output WAV file from VA, it starting to produce latency after about 20 seconds. I have tried individual tracks, or whole mix. Result is the same - latency that starts after ~20 seconds.

I have tried WASAPI and ASIO4ALL drivers.

Can somebody please help.
Thank you.

Dan,
Not only "Kasperski" but I had a different problem. I took USB key stick (which had the vArranger installation software on it) to another computer, and defender located and deleted software from the stick with next definition security patch update. So, it is a good idea to have installers on two computers with "white listed" on at least 1 system, so you have a backup. Dan, maybe you need to write to Microsoft, so they do not tag it as virus? I had similar issues with my site some years ago... IE filters used to block it for some of the customers. I had to write couple of letters to them, then they added it to "allowed" list of their filters. Never had such issue again.

Dan, it is a good starting point, and partly is usable. However BIAB is using Rests, Stops, Holds, that do not translate well into vArranger.
My idea was using some lines from styles to add to songs of BIAB, but it is not syncing to timeline well enough if rests/stops were used in BIAB. A lot of "chopping" needs to be done in DAW.
As I said, it is a good starting point.

Will it work if it is linear, no repeat bars?
If yes, please let me know how. Really interested.
Thank you.

Hi Dan.
I remember some month ago you said that there is development with taking BIAB chord sheets and importing them to VA. Can you please let me know if it was done?
If yes, how to use it please.

Thank you!

Hello Dan.
Can you please explain what was added in new version?
I see that effects save was added for some hardware users, but what else? This question was raised a few times in the thread were people are screaming "give me-give me!", but was never addressed.
Can you please explain what was added/changed?

Thank you.

Hi Dan.
I do see there are some changes... like audio input and some effects at VST window..
You mentioned VST... but I do not see the way to associate styles to different VST settings.
Is there something I am missing? Can you please write list of all changes from last version please, so everybody is aware.
Thank you!

[OK]

Hi Dan, not only Italians like to sing

I hope that "audio in" will be as a part of big update that I (and a lot of other members) are hoping to see by the end of the year. 

Atakis, nice stuff!
You know that I am a fan of the set... but some parts of trumpets playing  here are not very articulated / pronounced.
But then, good trumpets are one of the hardest instruments to pack in synth. Even Konakt Session Horns are not that good.
Maybe a mid frequency boost or "wide stereo" effect... I do not know. Just observing.

As longest the updates are related to the core of vArranger and not a specific hardware of specific users, that would make me happy...
Knowing it is not being abandoned. Will hold my breath until the end of the year

Well...
Not really sure about the "angry" part. Curious, yes! So you are confirming, there will be some sort of big update before the end of the year, correct?

Thank you.

Hi Dan.
It seems there had been very long time where any significant updates (like vsynth) were introduced to vArranger...
Are there any updates that are global, not just some minor things like "effects save" for small group of people that have SD1000 coming up any time soon? Or development of vArranger has stopped for the most part? I would not have asked if it did not seem that way. I am confident quite a few people here would want to know this.

Thank you.

zeljko, you should ask developer directly, not me. Developer does not monitor vArranger forum.

Hi Fellows.
I decided to start a new thread on this to share the news on 64 bit VSTSynthfont plugin. During  past few weeks, developer spent many
hours on improving  the core functions and features of this VST.  This is a fantastic tool/synth for playback of  midi and GM based compositions utilizing your own SF2, Gig, SFZ files or banks.  It is far more than just a VST synth.

It has many powerful features, such as:
64 Bit! (there is also a 32 Bit version available)
GM compatible!
Mixer
Individual channel transposition
Layering
Scenario saves
Multi file SF2  bank support
Sorting instruments by "Instrument Type" with corresponding instrument icons (given bank was assembled with GM structure).
Individual or mixed output for all 16 channels. You can actually stream/record 16 independent audio channels simultaneously into Daw.
Lock channel sound
Mute / Solo tracks
And many other great features.

Varranger users can use it as a VST synth to layer additional soundfonts  if they overlap in VA synth or substitute some of the instruments. So basically, you can have 2 independent SF2 Banks.

Demo is available.

There are simply no other tool like this to work with SF2/SFZ files
that is 64 bit and has so many features. It is priced very
reasonable and most importantly the developer cares about his
creation, listening to customers  and  fixing bugs in timely manner.

http://www.synthfont.com/ 

Scroll down to the middle of the page. The plugin is called: VSTSynthFont [3]
P.S. Developer mentioned that people who bought original version are
entitled for upgrade at no cost.

Here are some screenshots of new version:

Hey.
If you hear the drums, that is already a good sign.

1) Style files to Arranger Data / Styles / StylesROM1/
2) SF2 to Arranger Data / Sounds  / SAMPLES/

3)...ins.. tell you honestly, not sure. In my understanding VA reads names directly from files. Maybe someone explain better

When you copy SF2 and styles to folders. Open vArranger pick style. Then go to options on main screen. Select "Song Chords". Just select first chord A in the grid. Press play. If you start hearing style sound, other then drums, that means it is working.


After that is learning. Manual:
https://www.varranger.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page

Dan, I replied to your PM, but it bounced back:
Message:
. Deferred
Warning: message still undelivered after 4 hours

Not sure if you are aware of that.

Dan would you kindly answer to my reply to your private message. This is important to me.

Dan?

Dan, can you please reply to this?
I still think the best idea would be to be able to fast render all arranger channels into separate WAV files. One per channel simultaneously, same way Band In The Box does. (and ALL modern DAWS)
It will not overload anything. It should not be a problem at all for modern computers. This would be a smart way.

If vArranger had a good way of mixing tracks, Proper volume envelopes and support for complex mastering plugins such as Neutron 2 or Ozone,  I would never asked for it.   This is common sense approach.

Kindly reply.
Thank you.

Dan can you do this please?

Dan, I do not know why you are saying it will be out of sync on Record button press..Since you are not "rendering" audio, but recording in real time, midi clock will honor real time.
If you think a "note trigger" will be more accurate start position, sure. If you can make that permanent in my version, that would also work just fine for me.


P.S. ideally (and more professionally)  would be rendering all channels in separate files like BIAB does, but it seems I can not persuade you to do that.

Please let me know.

Dan, can you please do this for me?

Dan, of course I did. Many (MANY) times!  SF2 alone and  SF2+VST. I tried about 3 1/2 minutes, multiple WAV files Syncing fine in DAW.
But if the track sounds starts somewhere in the middle, I can not do it freehand.
Can you please remove this "start on sound" code for me that starts recording when START button is pressed so on the tracks that start sound later it records the silence.

PLEASE!!!

P.S. Band in the box renders many tracks at same time MIDi + AUDIO + MIX. Always syncing correctly.

Dan, support no longer applies?
Quote:
"Get direct support from the developer or in the forum. We help you with your setup and if needed, we assist you directly in your computer"

What I ask takes minutes to correct, not hours. In my case you are erasing code lane, not adding. Why you make it painful?

Hi Dan.
What it would take for you to make individual tracks record from TRUE starting point of the composition, not from "where the sound starts"?
You are helping people with their stuff, why not me? This issue should have been addressed as soon as you made the "feature" to start recording when sounds start, so people have an option not to use it if  they do not need it.. 

BIAB renders all tracks in separate files, including a mixed master without any latency or discrepancies that you were mentioning. Since, most likely this will never get done in Varranger, I kindly ask you at least to make it possible for individual (solo) tracks to be recorded from the start of the composition, not the start of the sound. If you do can not (do not) want to do it globally, can you please modify my version, so at least I do not suffer.

vArranger is your child. Do not be a drunkard father. Buy a small candy for your baby, you will not be broke.

Kindly let me know.
Thank you.

 zeljko,
I have several SF2 banks that I use with varranger.  It is a bit difficult to answer your question...depending on your setup and usage but basically yes, so I can use multifile SF2 banks (sounds) without major tweaking in other software.

For example, Synthfont VST can be used for recording multitrack audio from MIDI file made in VA in DAW or adding complex chain effects on individual tracks, which usually CRASH VA, because it is not  sophisticated enough compared with most major modern DAWS in their "hosting" abilities. For advanced mixing etc. I know, it is far from perfect, but it is the only thing that I know of that actually works.
I guess that answers stewbow post too. I am sure that varranger (vsynth) can be improved greatly, including proper audio communication with other software, but we get what we get and synthfont VST seems to be best candidate for the job.

I explained my view to Kenneth, that he has to focus more on GM/GS compatibility for his VST to be attractive. I believe he understands that and will improve. This is not rocket science. It is just passion and will of programmer.

It does work well, once you set it up correctly. It is a VST, not a standalone synth.  The only obvious issue I found is percussion channel that has to be set up manually. On developer website there are instructions.
I set up a template in Cakewalk. So once I open that template, I just have to import a Midi file from Varranger and it is ready to record.

zeljko, keep in mind it is test version, not very stable when setting banks for first time, but once you set it up, should work fine.
If you see any issues, please tell developer. He is listening and will try to address them.

There are a few people who are using outdated Samplelord... You can ask developer for demo of multi file Synthfont. I believe now it is a good time to bring suggestions to him. Samplelord was not updated for years and most likely abandoned by developer.

Ask developer directly. Tell him it is for Multibank SF2. He knows. It is still a beta and has some bugs, but enough to get started.

Here is the blind test of midi file created in VA from style played back in Cakewalk using synthfont VST and also loaded and played back through VA. (same soundfonts)  Can you tell which file was played where?

stewbow...

Lets pause here for a second..
Have you heard demos on this forum by Atakiss..thread titled "KETRON SD9 SF2 DEMO" or TA Sound engine SF2?
In my opinion quality of those 2 banks are way higher than SD2 module (which I had)

In any case, I spent great deal of time too, trying to merry VA to Cakewalk.
Dan was not helpful. So, I found the most "able" contender which is Synthfont 64bit VST for large SF2 banks.
But what is most important, the developer is a nice guy and he really tries to listens to what is needed to be done.

It might never evolve to be a dream SF2 engine. Or it might come out to be the best one for this task. The purpose of this thread is to make people who are interested in such tool aware, that there is such VST in the process.
Most of sound is moving from hardware to software direction. Except of course for instruments and controllers.  There are many people, including me that feel SF2 format still has great potential. Kontakt does not "feel" this way, because they want to sell licences and get that piece of the pie. At the end of the game it still same old WAV files

Sorry to not answer to your question straight, but yes, my goal is persuade developer to tweak VST so midi file does sound same as in va

stewbow,
Saved MIDI file from VA to Cakewalk and use primarily in Cakewalk as virtual sound module for SF2 banks.
This VST allows for 16 individual audio outputs to tracks. So I can record several tracks simultaneously directly in Cakewalk.

I would prefer to stream separate channels directly from VA to Cakewalk, but did not found a good way.

P.S. Another thing... There are no 64 bit VST that I could find that would accept large multi file SF2 banks, follow GM and have, mixer upfront and allow for individual track audio output. For 15 euro it is a good tool. Hopefully it will become better in near future.

Lylo. It is a good tool for sure. I am glad you tried it!
The 2 items that I have asked developer to make is.

A) Have true "SOLO / MUTE" buttons by each track.
It has a similar functions with keyboard shortcut now, but true SOLO / MUTE would be better in my opinion.

B)To have instrument picker at the track to "SEE" all similar instruments in SF2 folder, not just selected bank.
Guitars with guitars, pianos with pianos etc.


Lylo or any other member. If you trying this VST and see a bug or some feature missing that is crucial to play back VA arrangements, please
comment here or directly to developer.

Developer assured me that he is going to work on this VST within next couple of months, sometimes it is easier to modify program while it is in raw stage.

Thank you.

I feel, you did not understand the concept...
To use sounds elswhere you need synth. The problem is not the sounds, but a synth which will play arrangements in other software same way.  TA has nothing to do with synth, it is sound.  There are not many synths that accept large, multifile  SF2 banks and that will play GM standard correctly. Dan synth is one of them but NO VST to use other places.  The alternative synth I found, if you have interest you can read about in the thread titled: Alternative to  vasynth.

Best regards.


Ich fühle, du hast das Konzept nicht verstanden ...
Um Sounds überall zu verwenden, brauchen Sie Synth. Das Problem sind nicht die Sounds, sondern ein Synthesizer, der Arrangements in anderer Software auf die gleiche Weise spielt. TA hat nichts mit Synthesizer zu tun, es ist Sound. Es gibt nicht viele Synthesizer, die große, multiple SF2-Bänke akzeptieren und GM-Standard korrekt wiedergeben. Dan Synth ist einer von ihnen, aber KEINE VST, um andere Orte und den anderen Synthesizer zu verwenden, den ich fand, wenn Sie Interesse haben, können Sie über im Thread lesen, der betitelt wird: Alternative zu vasynth.

Freundliche Grüße.

P.S. Ich bin kein Moderator, aber das ist ein englisches Forum. Versuchen Sie, Google Übersetzer zu verwenden. Es funktioniert wie Magie.

Of course you do...me too..
But will it handle a large multifile SF2 banks and follow GM rules?? With some wierd scripting maybe / partially. Short answer, no.
Different animals for different jobs.  Synthfont is the right animal for this task.

Lylo, seems you did not read this thread. Someone already "suggested" that falconsoft VST.

This falconsoft is limited by not having mixer upfront, it has only 5 slots for SF2 files/banks.

Synthfont in my opinion is 10 steps ahead. Plus, owner is listening to his customers.

Multi-bank SF2 synthfont VST is in development stage, and I can confirm it is working! You can try the VST that is available for single bank now as full working demo for 30 days. And compare two. 

I did.

eallan, I do not believe it is possible.
I talked to that developer a few years ago and I do not believe it was not implemented. Coolsoft is solid, but it is VERY limited.

stewbow.,

synthfont VST is for a bit different purpose. My hope is that synthfont would be able to play midi files saved in varranger in other places like DAWS for recording and complex editing using SF2 Banks. Most of samplers available either old crap that nobody updated for many years or they have limitations such as not being able to load large SF2 banks or multi file banks, do not respond to program changes etc.  Synthfont VST is the most perspective one in my opinion to do all those things. And most importantly developer is a nice guy, who cares.

It sure can have some very nice features to be used in Varranger. Such as use it as VST with a different set of SF2 files other than one in "Samples" folder to layer some sounds or substitute some sounds that are not in the bank without doing editing to main bank etc.

V.muller.... you probably did not read the post.
I know about the programs you posted. These do not work well for one reason or another.
I already found the program that would behave very similar to vsynth in form of 64bit VST.

Synthfont.com

Developer agreed to modify it a little to make it work with large, multifile banks. He already done main work. I already have a beta version that works that I am testing.

Once more:

"the point of this thread is to have a discussion on who might be interested in it and what features it should have besides ones it already has and ones I have mentioned."

Since it is a work in progress, it is wise to think of the features to be available right away, because it might be more complicated to add them later.

Synthfont developer, unlike someone we know, does what he says. I do not want to miss this rare oppurtunity by not asking him for something that might be very usefull in the future.

From previous reply to your post:

"the point of this thread is to have a discussion on who might be interested in it and what features it should have besides ones
it already has and ones I have mentioned."

Since it is a work in progress, it is wise to think of the features to be available right away, because it might be more complicated to add them later.

Dan, I am sorry, I do not know what your plans are. You are right. I will put it in more truthful way then...

Dan was asked several times, for long time by different users to have vsynth as VST. He ignored discussion or refused to answer direct questions. I wish he would have a solution to bring VA (synth) to other software to use it as sound module, but as of yet, after years this has not happened.

To give Dan some credit, his soundest seems to be well balanced. If you are ok with price and using it only with varranger, maybe it is for you.

trans17a, of course I tried coolsoft. Developer is a nice guy. It is not a VST at all. It was meant for other purposes.

I do not understand, why you are keep suggesting something else? I believe I found the solution and a
caring, dedicated developer who is willing to try to modify his VST. Why dont you try a working synthfont demo that will accept single file SF2 bank?

The point of this thread is to have a discussion on who might be interested in it and what features it should have besides ones it already has and ones I have mentioned.

Anybody?

Somebody told me that Dans banks are encrypted,.which means they would not work in many other audio programs outside varranger.
Vsynth is good inside Varranger, but Dan has no plans to make it as a VST or such. Just a friendly warning.

Vsynth will play inside varranger. It will sound  good,  as good as your SF2 bank is.

Stewbow.
Lets start with mp3...... Why in the world mp3 for DAW when you have option of wav or flac?
There are plenty of acrobatics you can do, including hooking up 16 channel analog recorder to computer and then bouncing mix back to Cakewalk  to get individual tracks.

2 ways described in this thread would be ideal.,
A) output individual tracks.with correct time start simultaneusly (did I get this word right?) With fast rendering.
B) vsynth as VST.

But Dan will not make them. He has better things to do...  <= Edited by Dan :  No sarcasms here please


That said,  I started discussion about VST by Synthfont that hopefully will be able to accept large, multi file SF2
Banks to be used in other audio programs with midi files from varranger. Hopefully it will be completed in 2-3 month. It works now with a single file SF2 bank pretty well, but owner promissed to tune it for multi file / large file use. Full working 64 bit VST DeMo available at synthfont.com

trans17a...

I tried that.
BassmidiVSTi does NOT: change banks in multi file setup correctly and only has 4 slots for SF2, Does not have 16 channel mixer upfront where you can change instruments, volumes on one page.

If synthfont will succeed (and I have confidence it will) it will have a way to point to a FOLDER of SF2 Files. No matter if there is a single file or
many in that bank. 

The synthfont VST is not ready for multiple files yet, but you can try with single bank.
http://www.synthfont.com/Downloads.html

The file is:
VSTSynthFont (3.000) - VST instrument

32 or 64 bit.

15 days full working demo.

To those who use SF2 Banks (other than Dans).  I had done a long research on alternatives to Varranger Vsynth in a form of VST sampler... To use large SF2 banks in other software, so it plays arrangements made in Varranger midi files correctly. About a dozen of available VST have 4 main issues:
1)No bank / program changes
2)No GM support
3)Does not accept multiple file SF2 banks
4) Outdated 32bit, without a support for many years.

Then I remembered Synthfont (synthfont.com).. The owner released a 64 BIT VST, which actually works better than any other VST I have tried. Still does not have multiple file support, BUT owner agreed to give it a try and make adjustments to his 64 bit VST to support large banks and multiple files. I can confirm that mr. Kenneth started working on it as he sent me version for testing. It is not stable yet, but his words:
"I'll get it to work. I have managed very well before, I am confident."

I keep my fingers crossed and hope he will follow through. I promised him that I will post this here to see who might be interested in such VST.  If it works out, this will be in my opinion the only true software alternative to Dan vsynth to be used in different audio programs.

Kindly post your thoughts as my knowledge is limited. What features it should have besides these 4:
1) 64 Bit
2) Large, multi file SF2 file support (non encrypted)
3) Bank/ Patch change
4) GM rules.

Thank you.

Dan, 
the items you are describing do not take long to make.
If you are only "getting" to these things after people asked for them for many (MANY!) months... You can just be straight and tell me that you will not fix starting times. This "mystery" approach is not professional and a bit sickening. With your latest reply, I do not believe you will help me in any way to do what I asked for, to have the audio start, where it should start. Which (note start) was actually "added" as a "feature" by you, which can not be turned off by the user.

BjayG +1! You are very observing. I could not possibly put in more precise  wording.

To whom it may interest, a possible alternative to Dan's Vsynth please read my new post. I will put a title as "Alternative SF2 VST to Vsynth"
This thread is getting too depressing.

Selective customer support?

Dan, still waiting for an answer.
This is very important to me to be able to record separate audio lines as audio from start as timeline dictates not from the first note.

I have spent great hours in trying out different synth, to be able not to be dependent from Varranger on sound once the arranging is done. None are working properly with multiple SF2 files.

All the mastering and mixing are done in the DAW. Varranger will never have these capabilities, nor it was designed to do true mixing with envelopes or chain effects and all other fun stuff.

You are refusing to make vsynth as a VST which would be ideal,  please make so at least recorded audio solo tracks start in proper position of the timeline.

Please respond. If you know that you will not do this, kindly reply as well, so my time and hopes are not wasted for nothing.

Thank you.

Dan, you done coding... I am not a coder, but even I know it is easily insertable.

One example separate functions in "PLAY" in song mode from "START" button on main window by secondary function.
Logic: IF rec is pressed and "PLAY" button in pressed in "song chords", WAV recording starts from first bar of song regardless of notes. In this scenario all other functions will stay the same. In the same manner if "REC SYNC" is pressed follows rule "record on first note" if not pressed records whole line.

Second example, a bit brutal, but easily achievable. Have option to insert note at 1st second of the first bar on each track at lowest velocity, non audible to human ear. And in the menu where you select "type of file" to be recorded Wav/ Flac / MP3 have a small checkmark "record complete timeline". This way it will not interfere with what you say is by "design".

My guess is that you having thoughts as to how to "end" recording..... I can end it manually. As long as I have correct starting points, that will be ok.

I am sure there are many other ways to make this happen. But it narrows down to:

A)Record complete solo tracks in Varranger.
B)Have vsynth as a VST which could be used independently in DAW and of course it will resolve these and many other issues. As I mentioned, all modern DAWs record silence from start.

This is not new. I asked you many month ago about this. I have thought about it for a long time. Yes, there are a crazy workarounds. But A or B are the common sense ones. #B of course will serve more of your customers and make VA more desirable.

Let me know.

Correct start time at of solo tracks in "song" is a FIX because timeline makes the song not the "first note" of particular track.

VST- is a only a wish, that probably will not come to life anytime soon.  VST of course will fix the STARTING time, because allmodern DAWs will record silence BEFORE first note of the track...And obviously be useful to more of your customers.

stewbow:
Yes, mostly you are correct.
All I want is to be able to export individual audio tracks with correct starting point and hopefully with  option of live or fast rendering.

Lylo:
If Dan confirmed that VST is coming  in the next 3-6 month I would shut up and wait quietly, knowing that unpleasant, time consuming monkey labor would stop.
I do not think this will happen, at least not in near future. I agree, vSynth VST is the most proper solution for many different tasks.

I have seen discussions of some people (not on this forum) who where thinking of buying Varranger and their biggest concern was that Dan is stubborn and not flexible in admitting mistakes and fixing issues. That they would be dependent on 1 person instead of a team.
Take Cakewalk as an example. I was able to get in contact with their chief engineer Noel and he is a polite and helpful gentleman. Cakewalk has a user base 1000 times larger than varranger and I was pleasantly surprised by personal approach.

I mentioned this before, if Dan does not have time to work on VA, he can make "pay per feature" approach. If enough people want something, the join and pay for code segment. I just find the current approach a bit tasteless, but at the same time I believe that there is always opportunity to make situation better. That is why I am not giving up as some folks who stopped visiting this forum or those who sold their licences for the reasons mentioned above.

Dan, I am sure you will read this. Do not get offended.
When I write songs and send them to my friends I do not want to hear how "good" they are. I want to hear truthful, healthy critique, so I can try to be better in what I am doing by at least acknowledging my mistakes and trying to improve.    I wish same to you..., to improve connection with your followers and keep this project alive.

stewbow... please do not get mad... but why in the world you would want to bring hardware into this equation? 
It will add those many "extra" things that naturally you want to avoid, like:

1)More latency
2)More things that can go wrong.. drivers, compatibility, resource conflicts, etc.
3)Specialized expensive hardware
4)wire cluttering.
5)More artifacts in sound quality.
List goes on....

There are many different approaches to solve this smart way like:
A) Make vSynth as a VST
B)Make the CORRECT starting point in outputted solo tracks, hopefully with fast rendering.
C)Adjust 3rd party VST sampler (NOT the 32 BIT outdated sample lord) to accept SF2 banks and play them correctly, so it acts as VSTi sound module regardless which DAW or other place you will use them.

And several other software approaches, a bit more involved.

#B should be not complicated for Dan at all.  But I do not believe he is eager to help his customers for "mystery" reasons. With most of the features that people are asking almost all get some sort of vague promise but almost all never get completed.

P.S. Lylo, you are VERY helpful at times, but kindly do not advocate for Dan, I know your opinion, but I am entitled to my opinion
If this was a 35 euro program I would understand the lack of desire to improve, but I feel that it is a false advertisement in the sense of "Get FREE Support"
statement from Dan, which is on the top right corner of this page. I do not believe that promises to "look into" mean "support" in English or French.

My hope is that Dan wakes up from this comatose and does some good deeds by following through some things that people were waiting for.

Dan, if there was a VST that can use same SF2 Bank in the same manner as your vsynth, I would never ask this. Of course there is a way to record form start...
Start point of recording = start button in Varranger. Press start = start recording. 

"Tracks can drift and not stay in sync together" I know that feeling very well as I was battling with it for several month. The only solution is have correct start point of start of the timeline of recording....

And of course best solution that would resolve ALL issues if vsynth is a VST. that could be used in other programs.  But this probably will never happen.


The mixed audio WAV from Varranger does not sound good in DAW. It sounds MUCH better when it is properly mixed in DAW using envelopes. For all "hardware" users that is a non issue. For SF2 users... well alternatives are not good.

Dan, can you fix starting time of solo tracks?

Dan, kindly answer if you can fix correct starting times of solo tracks. I am waiting for your answer and hoping for a little customer help here.

Lylo, yes vst option of Vsynth would resolve this and actually is the best approach...it was proposed before.  But I do not have hope for this.

Samplelord does not output sf2 bank properly for me. The TX16 does not respond to program change and other issues. I tried that.

Dan, still waiting to hear on this.
Can you please fix starting points when recording solo tracks, so they correspond to "song arrangement" timeline?
Now, they do not correspond to timeline.

Please let me know.

Thank you.

Dan,
ok, you do not want, or can not do "record separate WAV tracks."  I got it. I will continue with monkey work.
Can you maybe show a little bit of effort and kindness and fix this:

When I SOLO the track to record individual channels, actual recorded WAV file starts where sound of that track starts. 
For example, if arrangement track #3 starts on the 15th second of the arrangement, on the recorded WAV it starts on the first second, it does not record the silence before that.

Can you make it so that recorded solo tracks occupy full length of song arrangement. So when solo tracks are recorded, they all have a correct starting point so it corresponds to the song time....

kindly answer.

thank you.

Dan, I am glad that at least you answered.
Ok, if not BULK export.  Can you at least make "render" song option, so it actually renders WAV (not records while playing) at full speed of CPU and not song tempo?

Please let me know.
thank you.

That is exactly what I was doing for the past several month.

That cost me:
A) many fruitless hours of "monkey labor" instead of making music. (This is all about music right?)
Something that should take less than a minute, takes an average of 30 minutes.

B) I do not hear whole mix, so I have to record everything "dry" to add envelopes in DAW later.

Lylo.
vArranger already records WAV MIX. All I want is not mixed tracks. Separate Wav tracks.
If it is complicated (which I do not believe), nothing will fall off from Dan in answering that by being simply polite.

stewbow., 3 things come to mind:

1) You clearly did not get what I was asking for.
2) You are generally happy with the support of 350 Euro software
3) quote: "when they closed down a few months ago. (Cakewalk)"  You do not follow up on the progress. 

I will start with the last one.

#3 Cakewalk was sold to a very interesting gentleman investor / musician from Singapore. He released Cakewalk Platinum, FREE for everyone. So far his team had fixed huge list of bugs and features in Cakewalk, something that previous owner Gibson was to LAZY to do. It seems he is listening to his followers and CARES deeply about them. I had been using Cakewalk for 20 years.

#2 What I proposed will not ADD any extra buttons on the screen for you to get confused, just have one more option in "saving file as" in submenu.  I would not worry about vArranhger becoming next BIAB

#1 V arranger designed as a multi channel player / MIXER. It is common sense to be able to render audio, saving them as separate tracks like you would with MIDI (individual instrument track per channel), but only what I am asking is AUDIO to be saved as separate files.

P.S. Hardware modules are a dying breed. Yes, there are some fantastic things out there, but they are disappearing rapidly, giving a way to software versions. Your computer=is your module, only much, much better.

And final thing. I believe I spoke clearly of being polite. I find it just distasteful to ignore a true customer for days in exchange replying to random posts of non-customers.

Hi Dan,
you replied to a newly joined person to forum in hours (who does NOT own Va), but you did not reply to my multiple emails in 7 days now, including this post, while I own 2 licences......

Even if you do not want to do reasonable and not complicated modification to VA that would save me and perhaps others valuable time, or simply because you do not like me, there is always a pollite way to do things....simply ignoring is  not one of them.

Hi Dan.
I was trying to write numerous times to you directly, but there was no response.  So trying here, on the forum to see if you will respond.

I asked about this long time ago, and I spend many fruitless  hours in trying to find a workaround instead of making music.

I, and I am sure many users are using vArranger with soundfont banks. It should be possible to export
separate WAV files for each tracks.  Because your soft synth is proprietary to vArranger, it can not be used in DAWs.  Midi file exported to DAW from Varranger creates many discrepancies because it is not using the same synth.

You have the sound engine figured out already. It should be easy to have "EXPORT AS SEPARATE WAV" files option. I really (REALLY!) need this because  WAV mixes from Varranger
sound dull. Since many people agree that progressive development of vArranger stagnated, I kindly ask you in this open forum to implement this feature.

I had spent many hours trying to find a solution, using various  VST "synths" in DAWs to support SF2 banks. It does not work well. The only solution to create a more or less reasonable mix is to have these separate wav files from separate channels.

Please let me, and perhaps others know if you can make "EXPORT AS SEPARATE WAV FILES"
option in "rec" mode. 

P.s. Not sure how to appeal to your consciousness.... If you do this, I promise not to bother you again asking for any features. I am willing to pay to make this happen.

Thank you.

Sure. Same programmer has a software called Sundog.... Try that too as it might suit you better. It has a free demo as well.
I wish that Dan and Hauke (Xotopad&Sundog studio owner)  would "talk" and create a nice, fairly priced "plugin" that is customized for vArranger.

....Taking in consideration what their dear, loving customers want out of the software which they are paying hard earned money instead of thieves who steal it
Oh well... It is not illegal yet to have hopes.

Pekilik, interesting, but I guess the layout and size (dynamic?) can not be freely changed?
Your touch controller is interesting, but very specific to VA, Xoto is more universal. I wish there was a hybrid Xoto@Pekilik controller
Is there a demo I can try?

I do not believe it will be done... at least not soon, judging by the pace of progress on some core functions / features...
But, the good news, you can try demo of XOTOPAD. See forum topic next to yours.  It has many chord pads / scales or make your own pads.
Simple to use too.

As for now, I do not have use for it ( led feedback). But you can ask Hauke (owner) yourself. He seems to be a responsive guy.
Again, I am not advertising, but kindly mentioning this as i myself was looking for simple programmable pads and sliders that can be run on SINGLE machine without bringing in android or ithings. Thats all

Akai LPK25
Wired $55
Wireless $75

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtGjriY2_5Y

Should do the  job. I believe it is fully programmable via computer.

Yes, it will work regardless of the 2 screens you will use it on. Again, demo is free. Download and play with it. I tried on two monitors, it works fine. I believe Dan said he wanted to make something similar a few years ago, but that did not happen.... So this, might be a better solution in the end as you can control multiple software applications that accept CC or notes/chords. Again, there are plenty controllers out there for Windows+Android and Windows+Apple products, but very a few for Windows, that can run on same machine (+ multiple monitors).

P.S. It seems that with Windows Anniversary update Miracast (wireless display) option had improved tremendously.  Wireless "extended" monitor works well on faster machines, especially if not using external network and connect to PC directly. (PC to PC) Still minor latency, but already very workable. Hopefully very soon it could be used as a full flagged touch controller.

It should. Working demo is available on developer site:
https://feelyoursound.com/xotopad/

P.S. these Pads can control  arranger if you are using more than one program. They  can always stay "on top" layer of any active program. Also, you can change transparency.

 Borys54

I use Yoga Thinkpad S1 (i7) 12.5 inch laptop, that converts to tablet.

Hi boys and girls!
It had been awfully quiet past days. I am hoping it is not seasonal mass depression

I want to share my experience with Xotopad + Varranger. I was looking for customizable pads to trigger different functions of Varranger for WINDOWS PC. There are many options for PC+Android and PC+ apple products. But almost nothing "user friendly" for PC.   With Xotopad, you can trigger whatever you need in VA, making nice LARGE buttons / sliders that you can use as touch controls. It does not look fancy and has some drawbacks, but it has very low latency and overall super stable. It can stay on the "Top" of Varranger. See last attached photo. This is the smallest (window) size possible for XOTO. I asked developer and he adjusted "smallest" size for me. He said this is the smallest it could be, without running into issues. Ohh, did I mention>? With Xotopad you can trigger chords in VA!!! It comes with huge library of chord templates/scales. See attached photos in the scale to Varranger. Anyway, I do not get paid for this, just wanted to share my joy

DEMO is free. Full version priced reasonable. This is the site: https://feelyoursound.com/xotopad/   

Dan, Thank you! It worked!

If somebody is following this thread, I wanted to add that besides Xotopad program, there is also a program Sundog  Studio from the same developer, Hauke of feelyoursound.com I think it is a very good companion for VA, especially for 2 screen setup. Very robust and clean programs. Try them, demos are available for both programs, and they are priced very reasonably.

Hi fellows.
Was researching different setups for mobile dual screen solution using VA. There are some very nice touch monitors out there, but I wanted to keep it as simple as possible.
I like to experiment with harmonies, so not being a piano player, triggering / finding chords by "ear" is the only rapid solution for me to create a backing track. That said....
I tried using ipad with a program called MidiDesigner, which is amazing program by itself, but I found that connection through a semi rogue "USB' connection is not reliable and very clumsy. Over the network, even worse...  I decided to give up evil apple device and try something different.

I have connected PC laptop via USB to Android tablet to make a dual (extension) screen setup. To my surprise, $9 program called Twomon USB worked amazingly stable. Almost true Plug and Play (It has automatic start) 
What I got,  is now I can drag VA screen for "monitoring" and using "touch" of Android tablet to control VA and using PC, which is also touchscreen for triggering items such as chords for example or other parameters in VA. Or another cool thing is having VA run on laptop screen and VST controls (Kontakt & others) on Android monitor. Well, I am sure it was done before... but for mobile setup it is super compact....also only one USB wire runs from tablet to laptop... When tablet sleeps, it switches from MPT to charging mode, so I do not have to change settings for charging.  Overall very happy with setup.

A question for Dan, or somebody who understands what is going on... I am trying to use program XOTOpad (which is a windows based triggering pad program) I do not have problems with triggering most chords, but the ones "on Bass" are not recognized by VA. For example Cmaj/G  would translate into C in VA, dropping Bass... Can somebody help me with this please. See attachments.

Thank you.